Metro to remove 41,000 cars from Dublin

[James Shields]

A few papers and sites carrying reports about the Metro.

28/02/06
14:09
Metro to remove 41,000 cars from Dublin

The new Metro will remove 41,000 cars a day from Dublin's streets
with a journey time from the City Centre to the Airport of 17
minutes, according to Transport minister Martin Cullen at the
launch of Metro North Public Consultation meeting today

Metro North, which is estimated to carry at least 80,000
passengers a day, will also integrate with Luas, Bus, Park & Ride
at Swords and Ballymun, cycling, taxi and rail services, the
Minister said

It will also integrate with other services in the city -
connecting with Metro West, the Maynooth rail line, the Tallaght
and Sandyford Luas lines and DART via the Interconnector at St.
Stephens Green

Minister Cullen also announced that the Dublin Bus network review
allows for bus services to be re-organised so that the bus
complements and feeds into Metro, thus extending the advantages to
other communities

The preparation work for the Metro will begin in the next few weeks


This external information has been sourced from Business World,
a service of Media World Ltd.

[Mark Gleeson]

Cullen pledges Dublin airport metro by 2012

Last updated: 28-02-06, 14:16
A metro service between Dublin city centre and the airport will carry 80,000 a day when and remove 41,000 cars from the capital's streets, Minister for Transport Martin Cullen said today.
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Speaking at the unveiling of the public consultation for Metro North in Dublin today, Mr Cullen said the journey between the city centre and the airport will be 17 minutes and 26 minutes to Swords.

It will have an initial frequency of four to five minutes, growing to every 90 seconds once demand builds, he predicted.

Mr Cullen said the Metro link will integrate with Luas and bus services as well as park-and-ride facilities in Swords and and Ballymun.

The new line will be approximately 18 kilometres long, and partly overground. Luas trams will be able to use the Metro line.

The planning, design and procurement stage of the project start this year and last until 2009, while construction will be finished by 2012, Mr Cullen said.

"We need and deserve a first-class transport system. We have the resources because of the hard work and enterprise of the Irish people and a Government that works with them," Mr Cullen said today.
"We are one of the few European cities without a rail link [to the airport]. Metro North corrects this and by going to Swords, achieves more."

© 2006 ireland.com
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/bre...breaking58.htm

[PaulM]

All this talk of "Busses feeding into metro" etc. makes me think metro-lite will be undercapacity on launch.

[Kevin K Kelehan]

All of course premature before we know what is actually proposed

[Mark Hennessy]

Dublin’s Metro should be up and running by 2012 carrying 80,000 passengers a day from St Stephen's Green to Swords, via the airport, it was claimed today.

As the three route options were unveiled, transport minister Martin Cullen claimed the 18km Metro North line would cut car journeys in the capital by 15 million a year.
Mr Cullen said the project will take four years to construct and will be paid for out of the Government's €34bn Transport 21 plan.

Minister Cullen refused to predict exactly how much the metro would cost.

“I’m not going to go out in the market with predicted figures opening up a mugging for the state. We know in broad terms what the project will cost,” the minister said.

All three routes start at Stephen’s Green running under Trinity College and the River Liffey before crossing beneath O’Connell Street.

Proposals on a central, west and east line are being put forward.

All three include underground sections, several kilometres at street level and an elevated section.
Plans for the central line, which the Railway Procurement Agency believes is the best, have included options for stations at stops including O’Connell Street, Mater Hospital and Botanic Road.

The line would come above ground before running onto Ballymun, out to the airport and onwards to Swords.

The west route has possible stops at Tower Street, the Rotunda and Broadstone before crossing the Cabra Road, running on to Finglas crossing the M50 near the exit for the N2 and onto the airport and Swords.

The east line includes possible stations at Hawkins Street, O’Connell Street, Mater Hospital, Drumcondra and Griffith Avenue before coming above ground near Whitehall. This line would then stop at Santry, the Clonshaugh Road before heading on to the airport.

A public consultation process began today giving businesses and residents along the proposed routes a chance to give their opinions. Public meetings will also take place between now and July for people to voice their concerns.

It is hoped the Metro will remove 41,000 cars a day from Dublin’s streets, with a train running at least every four minutes. Journey times from the city centre to the airport will take 17 minutes while commuters travelling to Swords will spend 26 minutes on the Metro.

Plans are already underway to ensure this system integrates with other services in the city including Luas, bus services and inter-city rail networks.

“Metro will reduce travel times and congestion, improve the reliability, availability and quality of public transport, and make public transport more attractive to car users,” Mr Cullen said.

“Reducing car journeys can only have a beneficial effect on the net air quality in Dublin. Metro is set to improve the quality of life for the people of Dublin and for those visiting the capital on business or as tourists.”

Padraic White, RPA chairman, said: “While the Metro would serve the airport it was estimated that 80 per cent of passengers would be commuters living on Dublin’s north side.”

He revealed the RPA would choose the preferred route in July and a formal railway order would be submitted to the minister in 2007.

Work on the Metro, which will last for at least four years looks set to begin in 2008 with the RPA overseeing the project with the help of Dublin City Council, Fingal County Council and the Dublin Airport Authority.

Tests on underground conditions throughout the city are due to begin in the coming weeks but the RPA insisted Metro North would not run into many of the problems and controversies which surrounded the over-budget, behind schedule Dublin port tunnel.

Officials revealed the Metro tunnel would be at least half the size at 5.5 metres, built between 20 to 50 metres below the surface for some eight-nine kilometres.

Mr White also said the RPA was committed to giving residents and businesses their say on the massive project.

“Consultation is an essential part of the process in the delivery of Metro North and we are determined to make this process of consultation as extensive as possible whilst sticking to a very ambitious deadline,” he said.

Mr Cullen and the RPA also said plans and proposals for Metro lines in the west of the city serving Clondalkin, Tallaght and Blanchardstown would also be published in the coming months with a view to begin construction in the next five years.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/2006/02/28/story246963.html

[alek smart]

Hmmm....Is this the same City Authority which is wringing it`s hands and Ochon Ochoning in relation to removing Pay and Display Car Parking from Parnell Square ..?
These lads no more want to reduce the daily traffic count by 41,000 cars than they want to sniff radioactive snuff.

Ok..how about this then....ELIMINATE all on-street Pay Parking.
ALL centre city parking to be off-street or multi-storey.
The immediate conversion of the resultant free space into Pedestrian and Public Transport interactive areas.
The conversion of at least ONE existing Multi-Storey into a Bus Interchange.

This relatively simple strategy would be a very forceful way of Kick Starting the T21 principles in the Capital........

Holding my breath ..now!!!

[Thomas J Stamp]

It'll actually remove about 10,000 and decimate the bus services to Swords, Ballymun and Finglas, a la luas does to Dundrum and the DART did 20 years ago to the 8,7 ect routes.

[philip]

I'd be more optimistic for the metro given it's main P&R will be in the best place possible, right out at Lissenhall with no traffic problems getting to it from the north. I actually haven't a clue how many cars it'll remove but I wouldn't attempt to drive past Lissenhall if I were going to anywhere near the city. I hope they don't charge OTT for Lissenhall. They shouldn't really as there's nothing else in the vicinity to park for!

[Maskhadov]

The metro in Barcelona is nice and cheap. they should follow that example

[sean]

Especially if Irish Rail took a leaf out of my "Channelling" idea, 20 potentially ful trains per hour would be going through Glasnevin area in peak time, if even a fraction of those passengers used the Metro (especially the puny tram thingies) the Metro would be swamped from Day 1.

[philip]

Dunno Sean, there will be a lot more options available to people in 10 years. There'll be a metro to the airport via Ballymun at Porterstown and a tram to change to at Broombridge before the DART even gets to Glasnevin Junction, that'll take the DIT students and perhaps some city centre pax if they are headed to to Harcourt street etc. instead of changing twice. People will have different patterns when everything's in place.

As for the puny trams, we're satisfied as an organisation that the capacity will be adequate now. That's what my understanding of it is anyway. The metro will hopefully be crush loaded at peak times, that's what's supposed to happen or your system is OTT and costing you too much.

[James Shields]

Especially if Irish Rail took a leaf out of my "Channelling" idea, 20 potentially ful trains per hour would be going through Glasnevin area in peak time

I think I missed that one. I presume it uses the Midland line and the Park tunnel?

Maybe we should keep quiet about that one - might put the frightners on the RPA and make them refuse the Glasnevin Junction interchange even more strongly.

I think with 90m trains Metro should match the capacity of a DART line.

[philip]

Didn't Mark say 33k/h? That's massive for 1 line. Sure the DART does what, 100k an day tops at the moment? There's plenty of capacity in that metro line and by the time the line route densifies to make it an issue there will be other lines. Things are gonna be rough for the public transport passenger for a number of years yet, even post T21 there will be dead spots needing more Luas and metro. The airport spur might someday come back too, if the line can be 4 tracked to beyond Howth Junction. I'm glad I live on the northside though, the older parts of the southside are gonna have to wait some time yet. Post T21 it would still be quite unfair to charge many in the likes of Kimmage for congestion charging, which is a shame. It should be the goal to be able to charge cars out of town.

[sean]

The idea was floated (though not very well) on the Glasnevin Junction thread.

That if you managed to pack everything going to/from the Clonsilla direction onto the Midland line, leaving the Drumcondra line abandoned, you could take a bunch of trains from Heuston Islandbridge into Connolly and the Docks. So you could for example take the key Intercity trains into Connolly and main Commuter services into Spencer Dock.

If the Sligo and Longford trains were rerouted to terminate South of Connolly, even more conflicts would be abolished as would demands on Connolly platform time, and the implementation of the DRP would eliminate virtually all running-service conflicts.

In summary, the theoretical capacity of the Junction is, in my veiw, something of an order several times what is currently being exploited - possibly up to 10x.

That could change at any time and yes, the RPA should be scared.

[philip]

But that would leave Heuston basically empty, would it not? I see no problem using Heuston as much as possible for IC services. Anyone coming from Cork etc. won't mind being able to descend a flight of stairs to a DART to Stephen's Green etc. It's as good as you'll get in London arriving into every mainline station there. Even plenty of european cities are like that.

I would like outer commuter trains to be able to use the Drumcondra line someday and Sligo/Maynooth use the Midland but this only needs to happen if there are serious numbers of Kildare outer commuter trains wanting to get to Connolly.

The plans today are DART to Hazelhatch but I'd rather extend to Kildare and let them use the interconnector directly to St. Stephen's green than spend money on two new (pretty expensive) stations on the Midland Line (you'd need to build a twin for Drumcondra too).

In the context of a DART to Kildare you're only talking Portlaoise and Carlow commuter trains that might be diverted to Connolly/Spencer Dock. I think the Drumcondra Line could actually take those in it's stride.

In an ideal world I'd like to see what you're suggesting Sean but I don't think it'll happen until well after T21. The good thing about T21 is that it'll get many more people used to good connections and then people will demand the sort of extras you mention. At the moment 95% of people don't expect us to ever be like a proper european city and as things start to be delivered this will change. I can't wait until everyone in Dublin is screaming for improvements.

[sean]

No, it wouldn't leave Heuston empty. remember DARTs not going to Kildare, so that's a bunch of trains that cant use the Interconnector.

Throw in up to 6 Commuter trains per hour to/from places like Athlone and up to 6 Intercities per hour from 2008.

You couldn't send more than 10 TPH over the Phoinex Park Line and even that is probably pushing the envelope. That still leaves roughly 2 TPH that have to stay in Heuston.

The redeployment of trains to Connolly and the Docks would be for premium trains, such as the CDE Intercity could go to Connolly station terminal. Also, Commuter trains that are known to be the most utilised could be sent to Islandbridge and the Docklands.

Some stuff would stil terminate in Heuston such as lower-priority Commuter trains and lightly used or experimental Intercity services could terminate there also such as Mayo direct services.

But that is off topic.

------------------------------

My question is, if this were done, and there was an interchage somewhere near Glasnevin, what would the likely effect of 20TPH interchanging with the Metro be on the Metros ridership?

[Mark Gleeson]

A bit or realism is required with respect to train services through Glasnevin

Dublin Cork services are not going to use the Park Tunnel the time cost is excessive so you need more rolling stock The park tunnel is of primary use before the interconnector is built afterwards. DART services on the Maynooth line are not proposed for the Midland line thus very limited capacity exists on the Drumcondra route.

Connolly and Spencer Dock are small terminals by standards and Connolly will be at its limit with expanded Sligo, Belfast and full responsibility for Dundalk services.

No one can can make any firm plans until the publication of the inquiry report in the Kildare Route Project it may or may not force the issue and its worth waiting

Integration with the Metro is complex and requires a lot of thought and it requires tradeoffs put simply this requries a lot of research into where people are coming from and going to

[philip]

Originally Posted by sean

My question is, if this were done, and there was an interchage somewhere near Glasnevin, what would the likely effect of 20TPH interchanging with the Metro be on the Metros ridership?

I don't think it'll kill it. The metro is to be 33k per hour capacity. People on these PPT trains would have already been able to change to metroWest at Kishoge for Dublin Airport and then at Heuston for much of the south inner city with the DART and indeed parts of the north inner city with Luas or stay on board to Connolly/Spencer Dock for the IFSC. I actually think the numbers changing from PPT trains would only really amount to DCU students and a handful of others. Nothing that could swamp the system. Most changes will be from Maynooth/Sligo trains who are headed for the north and south inner city. I think we're forgetting just how much 33k people looks like. The DART does only 3 times that number in an entire day. I'd like to see the option but to install two stations on the midland line (and electrify it for Maynooth DARTs) would be considerably expensive. I'd rather direct that cash at quading the Kildare line to Kildare and electrifying that as per the orignal plan and allowing far more 0 change journeys that way, same with Drogheda.

[Donal Quinn]

Originally Posted by philip

(you'd need to build a twin for Drumcondra too).

that pedometer site is class
thought i'd use it to show the best location for a second station in drumcondra

http://www.gmap-pedometer.com/?r=55723

thats a 230m long platform there with space for more

the idea is that it DOESN'T open on to jones rd as there are crowd safety implications so close to the stadium
instead opens on to drumcondra rd - still a short walk to croker
of course if the GAA wanted to pay for and build an entrance to the station (closed on match days)on the croker side so people could use it for their conference and hotel (one change to airport!) there'd be no bother there

[Maskhadov]

Originally Posted by philip

Didn't Mark say 33k/h? That's massive for 1 line. Sure the DART does what, 100k an day tops at the moment? There's plenty of capacity in that metro line and by the time the line route densifies to make it an issue there will be other lines. Things are gonna be rough for the public transport passenger for a number of years yet, even post T21 there will be dead spots needing more Luas and metro. The airport spur might someday come back too, if the line can be 4 tracked to beyond Howth Junction. I'm glad I live on the northside though, the older parts of the southside are gonna have to wait some time yet. Post T21 it would still be quite unfair to charge many in the likes of Kimmage for congestion charging, which is a shame. It should be the goal to be able to charge cars out of town.

What we need post T-21 is another 2 + Metro Lines. I think we probably need a outer orbital metro line and something that serves the port area ( for the port project). Still there will lots of area with no access to decent public infastructure.