Folding bikes in Ireland

[packetswitch]

So, my new toy is a folding bicycle, not that much fun in current weather but never mind. Any of you have experience with bringing one of these babies on IÉ or Luas services? They should be treated as 'luggage' rather than bicycles, once folded. Most operators in the UK require you to cover them too (i.e. a folded bike must be in a bag/case before it's acceptable for bringing onto a 'non-bicycle' service such as a commuter train). How about on platforms - can you wheel as far as the train door and then fold?

[Mark Gleeson]

Reports are positive

http://forum.platform11.org/showthread.php?t=639

[packetswitch]

Sounds good. Not sure how I missed that while searching. If sandraoh's reading, what sort of staff attitude/reaction are you getting with your folder?

Requiring some form of 'cover' (but not a box/case) seems reasonable. Especially for buses, if the driver doesn't see the wheels, it's not his/her problem! I have taken it on Dublin Bus city buses a few times already and no problem - although finding somewhere to put it isn't necessarily easy.

Would be handy to bring together cycle experiences (for 'regulars' as well as folding) and have it in one place. This UK page is brilliant, although of course it's necessary given the variety of operators on the national rail network.

[Mark Gleeson]

Once its compact you should be able to leave it in the luggage van. Staff on the new Cork train seem most helpful

[Derek Wheeler]

I am in very "abstract" contact with the Dublin cycling campaign. Its my fault that I haven't got to one of their meetings. (I have been invited) But I do intend to, because I want to forge links between the 2 groups on the basis of bikes and the railway. I think this could be a very good grouping. However, it will depend on my time and its allowance to afford me the opportunity.

Sometimes I wish there were 48 hours in a day and 10 more committee members! Apologies to the Dublin Cycling Camapign.

[packetswitch]

Allow me a moment of nostalgia, I have a very fond memory of a rail-related cycling campaign, think would have been in the summer of 2002, Dublin Cycling Campaign were annoyed about cycle parking at Heuston, so in conjunction with the then-regular Friday-once-a-month Critical Mass rides, the route changed to take in Heuston, and then we gleefully rode in and around the platforms (nr. current platform 4 I think, obviously there have been various changes since then) and the main hall...a very very surreal experience and I think a successful one, as they got a meeting with various Heuston staff shortly afterwards. A few cycle-friendly politicians (Ciarán Cuffe, Joan Burton, can't remember who else) were also in blatant disregard of multiple bye-laws on that sunny summer's evening...

Ah, here it is: http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/0628/rail.html. June 2002 it was.

[Colm Moore]

I am a member of Dublin Cycling Campaign.

Originally Posted by packetswitch

Allow me a moment of nostalgia, I have a very fond memory of a rail-related cycling campaign, think would have been in the summer of 2002, Dublin Cycling Campaign were annoyed about cycle parking at Heuston, so in conjunction with the then-regular Friday-once-a-month Critical Mass rides, the route changed to take in Heuston, and then we gleefully rode in and around the platforms (nr. current platform 4 I think, obviously there have been various changes since then) and the main hall...a very very surreal experience and I think a successful one, as they got a meeting with various Heuston staff shortly afterwards. A few cycle-friendly politicians (Ciarán Cuffe, Joan Burton, can't remember who else) were also in blatant disregard of multiple bye-laws on that sunny summer's evening...

Ah, here it is: http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/0628/rail.html. June 2002 it was.

The above events were before my time, but also Critical Mass is a separate organisation (it isn't even formally organised).

I was told the only way they got what they got was by making Brennab's life intolerable.

[eireguy]

I don't think bikes of whatever nature should be let on trains unless there is a special tram to put them all in, would you bring a bike on a bus, NO you would not. I'm a frequent on the Cork - Dublin line, which is an excellent service and I am sick of hearing people complaining about it, just remember, 20 years ago this state was broke, and only now are we getting back to a good public service. I think give it time, and it will work out. Oh back to my point, the cork - Dublin line, i get on at limerick junction, and when its a match weekend it chaos, completely overcrowded, and the additions of bikes or extra unnecessary luggage would not be welcome by me.

* one final thing REOPEN Duleek station as part of the Navan - Drogheda - Dublin campaign. Duleek is now the central gateway in Meath and only 45 mins from Dublin.

[packetswitch]

Originally Posted by eireguy

I don't think bikes of whatever nature should be let on trains unless there is a special tram to put them all in, would you bring a bike on a bus, NO you would not.

Do you have a buffet car on a bus?

Do you have first class on a bus?

Do you have seat reservations on a bus?

Do you have buses with 8 carriages?

Trains are different to buses; they have different purposes and serve (somewhat) different needs. If handled properly, bicycles on trains without guards' vans can be OK - it is common on some UK services that have simple commuter trains (i.e. DMUs like our current suburban trains to Maynooth, etc) but with restricted numbers or designated locations.

There are lots of things that you can do on trains that you cannot do on buses. I don't think that should be the criteria for policy towards cycling.

[ooleary]

I don't think bikes of whatever nature should be let on trains unless there is a special tram to put them all in, would you bring a bike on a bus, NO you would not.

Ahh you're baiting us now...

In some other parts of the world they've had bike racks on buses since the 70s...

http://www.metrokc.gov/kcdot/news/th...20513_bike.htm
http://www.sfmuni.com/cms/mrider/bikes.htm

and generally speaking I've had no problems brining a bike on Bus Eireann or CityLink routes (so long as the baggage section isn't full).

Other public transport systems seem to have the bike thing down, in some form or other.
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tube/using/get...d/bicycles.asp
http://www.db.de/site/bahn/en/travel...ahn__bike.html

[Mark Gleeson]

Dublin Cork is no problem there is a lovely big clean luggage van for the purpose

Tralee Mallow despite appearances you can bring a bike, the only lines where you can't Dublin Sligo (except on the Fridays only train), Dublin Rosslare and all suburban services

If you look at the original DART coaches and some of the railcars there is no space to even consider fitting a rack to hold a bike. It doesn't matter what time of day it is full standing loads are frequent at off peak on suburban trains

Of course a fold up bike can go anywhere

[eireguy]

to be honest, if i was on a train crammed and unnecessary (bikes) baggage taking up room, I would not hesitate telling the guy to remove it, if they can be put away then fine otherwise the answer should be NO.

[zag]

Enter 'bike rack bus' into http://images.google.com and you will indeed see that plenty of cities around the world allows bikes on buses.

In Wellington in New Zealand they carry childrens buggies in a similar way on the front of the bus. It takes a while to get used to the sight.

z

[Mark Gleeson]

The luggage van is normally empty,

The new Cork train was specifically designed for large amounts of luggage, the overhead racks are much larger than normal, I've yet to see something which won't fit

You have to pay to carry a bike so if properly stowed in the luggage van there can be no objection. Its not taking up space usable by passengers. It is of course not permitted for passengers to travel in the luggage area

[packetswitch]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

Its not taking up space usable by passengers. It is of course not permitted for passengers to travel in the luggage area

Don't give IÉ ideas.

Rosslare and Sligo should change with the new trains if/when they arrive; bikes will be permitted once more.

There's no reason why (for example) bicycles shouldn't be permitted on railcars doing the Ballina/Westport shuttle, space permitting. A common way to deal with it is to restrict non-luggage-van cycles to off-peak only. The Ontario GO trains have this policy, it's enforced, and I never had irate passengers giving the type of reaction above. Cycles have been transported by rail for years, so it's time that people got used to it; the Irish network is comparatively tight when it comes to facilitating bicycles. The UK policies, while more complicated, are more generous.

There is also no reason why conveying a non-folding bike by DART or commuter should always be impossible. One option is to allow it against the direction of peak travel (so for example it would be OK to bring a bike on Bray-Dublin at 5pm but not the other way). In systems where this approach is taken, cyclists get to know the rules and work to them as best they can.

[al2637]

Or else just provide enough capacity so that there is room for them! If we are serious about getting people to switch from cars to public transport this must be done. Crush load is not sustainable even for peak services. I know it is pretty common all over the world, but as governments and councils try and get more and more people to make the switch, they are beginning to realize people won't tolerate this anymore!

[packetswitch]

Ciarán Cuffe just called for bikes on DART/Commuter on Radio 1. Apparently he went to Berlin and saw bikes-on-trains everywhere.

[Rien Schuurhuis]

For my final thesis at the University of Canberra (Australia) in combination with the Delft University of Technology (the Netherlands) I am executing a research on foldable bicycles used for commuting. For this purpose I made a survey with a few questions concerning foldable bicycles. It would be of great help if you could help me by filling in this survey. For the survey it doesn’t matter whether you possess a foldable bicycle or not.
http://www.thesistools.com/?qid=73617&ln=eng

Thanks in advance!
Rien Schuurhuis

[Traincustomer]

An interesting thread. In the UK there are leaflets generally available quite widely about bringing your bicycle by train.

Some years ago I took my bike on a Bus Éireann service without any problems. And my brother did so more recently with no problems.

[Colm Moore]

Update: http://www.railusers.ie/forum/showth...3207#post43207