A Rant

Derek Wheeler · 30-08-2006, 22:33

Im sticking it in here because it contains neither factual info and poses the most rediculous questions.

The official line on the lack of integrated ticketing in Dublin, has been described as a dispute between transport providers and the division of revenue from an all in one ticket.

So how the hell is revenue divided between Luas and DB, when DB "honour" Luas tickets in the event of a failure? Well? Somebody? Anybody?

Another thing that really gets on my wick, is the almost "never never land" way Dublin City Council continue to "decorate" the city such as the O'Connell street improvements. All of us know, its gonna be dug up for the Luas link up. We also know that it will invariably be dug up again for Metro north. Does anyone talk to each other in the corridors of the civil service.

And now, on a stretch of road, that has been heavily featured in the media and elsewhere (Drumcondra rd) DCC are installing a lovely length of traffic island at a location that will inevitably be closed off and excavated for metro north. Now I do know that DCC are unhappy about the proposal to dig out a metro station at this point, so maybe its not a traffic island at all. Maybe its a barricade that will be manned by traffic wardens, who will fight the metro contractors to the death. 500 years from now the city will be a major tourist attraction.

"this marks the site of the battle of drumcondra road. It made Brian Boru and his buddies down in Clontarf look like a bunch of adolescent girls cat fighting over a trainer bra!"

"and now we enter O'Connell street, where a different type of battle took place. It was known as the battle of bureaucracy. A unique battle in that not a life was lost. But it inflicted a suffering of a different kind on the weary citizens of Dublin. "

Thomas J Stamp · 31-08-2006, 09:02

add to that the way that Henry Street was relaid with specially imported granite slabs that were dug up and replaced with Tarmack by DCC for pipelaying shortly afterwards.

Wonderful.

PaulM · 31-08-2006, 10:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas J Stamp

add to that the way that Henry Street was relaid with specially imported granite slabs that were dug up and replaced with Tarmack by DCC for pipelaying shortly afterwards.

That is one of my favourite. Dig up concrete, cobbles or any form of road surface and replace it with badly laid, uneven cheap tar. I love the organisational skills and determination of this city....

constellation · 31-08-2006, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek Wheeler

Another thing that really gets on my wick, is the almost "never never land" way Dublin City Council continue to "decorate" the city such as the O'Connell street improvements. All of us know, its gonna be dug up for the Luas link up. We also know that it will invariably be dug up again for Metro north. Does anyone talk to each other in the corridors of the civil service.

Bertie Ahern. 1916 Commemoration. Re-election. 'Nuff said about that.

Why put off tomorrow what you can screw up today.

Regarding integrated ticketing. It does exist. It's called the Free Travel Pass.

Okay, okay. Not funny. Points for effort?

Mark Gleeson · 31-08-2006, 15:21

You can get a Bus/Luas/Rail all journeys everywhere ticket it does work

DCC will of course tell you that there exists no planning approval for anything on O'Connell Street and until something does they will pimp it up as much as they like

Derek Wheeler · 31-08-2006, 19:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by constellation

Bertie Ahern. 1916 Commemoration. Re-election. 'Nuff said about that.

Why put off tomorrow what you can screw up today.

Regarding integrated ticketing. It does exist. It's called the Free Travel Pass.

Okay, okay. Not funny. Points for effort?

Full marks C.

Derek Wheeler · 31-08-2006, 19:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

DCC will of course tell you that there exists no planning approval for anything on O'Connell Street and until something does they will pimp it up as much as they like

Now now Mark!

You're beginning to sound like the people Im having a go at.

James Shields · 01-09-2006, 22:23

I totally agree with you Derek. Over a year when O'Connell Street was in the middle of being dug up, I was pointing out the this would be the ideal time to reroute any services under where Luas would eventually go, and to install a big concrete box for the Metro (though, of course, at that point it was going to be outside the Gresham).

It's a tricky situation, though. When the planning process was underway for the O'Connell Street renewal, Luas and Metro were both pie in the sky, and it would have been very easy to dismiss them as never going to happen. If the project was delayed to wait for Metro and Luas, the press would jump on it and make an issue of the disgrace that is our capital's main street being left for another ten years. I fear the council are damned if they do, damned if they don't on this one.

And if they had tried to take a preemptive approach, they would have spent millions putting a station box outside the Gresham, only o find that the favoured location for the O'Connell St station is now at the other end of the street.

markpb · 02-09-2006, 10:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by lostcarpark

I totally agree with you Derek. Over a year when O'Connell Street was in the middle of being dug up, I was pointing out the this would be the ideal time to reroute any services under where Luas would eventually go, and to install a big concrete box for the Metro (though, of course, at that point it was going to be outside the Gresham).

As far as I know, one of the reasons the renovation of OCS took so long was that most/all of the utilities were being rerouted and mapped to make any future work on the street much easier.

Building a station box, apart from being risky without a definite location, would never happen because RPA would have had to agree to pay DCC for the work and that level of co-operation is far from reality in Ireland

Thomas J Stamp · 02-09-2006, 11:11

On the same subject, but slightly different, I posted months ago that DCC shoul already be re-routing the utilities along the luas line in Mayor street every weekend , not waiting untill the last monent and dig the entire street up at once and during the working week, which is what they will do, of course.

James Shields · 02-09-2006, 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas J Stamp

On the same subject, but slightly different, I posted months ago that DCC shoul already be re-routing the utilities along the luas line in Mayor street every weekend , not waiting untill the last monent and dig the entire street up at once and during the working week, which is what they will do, of course.

I've seen guys out with boxes of electronic mapping equipment, which apparently can build up a realistic map what's under the street. I think it's something that they have to plan carefully to make sure there are no foul-ups that have the banks crying bloody murder.

colmoc · 04-09-2006, 09:28

what I cant understand is why the local councils dont force service provider companies (telco's, cable TV, esb, gas, water, sewerage ... ) to at least cooperate on digging up streets and relaying them.

I have seen streets newly laid in tarmac only for "Sierra" to dig it up a week later to put cables in then badly cover it up and leave man holes which are 5-10 cm below/above road level

this carry on is leathal to any cyclist and ruins cars tyres and suspension.

Why cant they all use the same tunnel network like in paris ??

Colm Donoghue · 04-09-2006, 12:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by colmoc

what I cant understand is why the local councils dont force service provider companies (telco's, cable TV, esb, gas, water, sewerage ... ) to at least cooperate on digging up streets and relaying them.

I have seen streets newly laid in tarmac only for "Sierra" to dig it up a week later to put cables in then badly cover it up and leave man holes which are 5-10 cm below/above road level

this carry on is leathal to any cyclist and ruins cars tyres and suspension.

Why cant they all use the same tunnel network like in paris ??

I think "sierra" et al can't replace the top surface, and are actually meant to only replace it with a temporary surface for a time to allow the fill to compact.
from the corpo's road works manual.

Gobdaw · 04-09-2006, 13:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by colmd

I think "sierra" et al can't replace the top surface, and are actually meant to only replace it with a temporary surface for a time to allow the fill to compact.
from the corpo's road works manual.

Not any more (nor for some time). You dig a hole, you fix it, your responsible for the hole (and the surface) for all eternity. Someone trips, its your fault, not corpo.

Derek Wheeler · 05-09-2006, 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobdaw

Not any more (nor for some time). You dig a hole, you fix it, your responsible for the hole (and the surface) for all eternity. Someone trips, its your fault, not corpo.

Thats quite correct, but is rarely enforced on contractors and has lead to some scary legal cases, still in process, I believe.

30-08-2006, 22:33	#1
Derek Wheeler Registered user Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kildare Posts: 1,555	A Rant Im sticking it in here because it contains neither factual info and poses the most rediculous questions. The official line on the lack of integrated ticketing in Dublin, has been described as a dispute between transport providers and the division of revenue from an all in one ticket. So how the hell is revenue divided between Luas and DB, when DB "honour" Luas tickets in the event of a failure? Well? Somebody? Anybody? Another thing that really gets on my wick, is the almost "never never land" way Dublin City Council continue to "decorate" the city such as the O'Connell street improvements. All of us know, its gonna be dug up for the Luas link up. We also know that it will invariably be dug up again for Metro north. Does anyone talk to each other in the corridors of the civil service. And now, on a stretch of road, that has been heavily featured in the media and elsewhere (Drumcondra rd) DCC are installing a lovely length of traffic island at a location that will inevitably be closed off and excavated for metro north. Now I do know that DCC are unhappy about the proposal to dig out a metro station at this point, so maybe its not a traffic island at all. Maybe its a barricade that will be manned by traffic wardens, who will fight the metro contractors to the death. 500 years from now the city will be a major tourist attraction. "this marks the site of the battle of drumcondra road. It made Brian Boru and his buddies down in Clontarf look like a bunch of adolescent girls cat fighting over a trainer bra!" "and now we enter O'Connell street, where a different type of battle took place. It was known as the battle of bureaucracy. A unique battle in that not a life was lost. But it inflicted a suffering of a different kind on the weary citizens of Dublin. "

31-08-2006, 09:02	#2
Thomas J Stamp Chairman/Publicity Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: The Home of Hurling Posts: 2,708	add to that the way that Henry Street was relaid with specially imported granite slabs that were dug up and replaced with Tarmack by DCC for pipelaying shortly afterwards. Wonderful. __________________ We are the passengers

02-09-2006, 11:11	#10
Thomas J Stamp Chairman/Publicity Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: The Home of Hurling Posts: 2,708	On the same subject, but slightly different, I posted months ago that DCC shoul already be re-routing the utilities along the luas line in Mayor street every weekend , not waiting untill the last monent and dig the entire street up at once and during the working week, which is what they will do, of course. __________________ We are the passengers

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31-08-2006, 15:21	#5
Mark Gleeson Technical Officer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Coach C, Seat 33 Posts: 12,669	You can get a Bus/Luas/Rail all journeys everywhere ticket it does work DCC will of course tell you that there exists no planning approval for anything on O'Connell Street and until something does they will pimp it up as much as they like

01-09-2006, 22:23	#8
James Shields Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Drogheda, Ireland Posts: 1,275	I totally agree with you Derek. Over a year when O'Connell Street was in the middle of being dug up, I was pointing out the this would be the ideal time to reroute any services under where Luas would eventually go, and to install a big concrete box for the Metro (though, of course, at that point it was going to be outside the Gresham). It's a tricky situation, though. When the planning process was underway for the O'Connell Street renewal, Luas and Metro were both pie in the sky, and it would have been very easy to dismiss them as never going to happen. If the project was delayed to wait for Metro and Luas, the press would jump on it and make an issue of the disgrace that is our capital's main street being left for another ten years. I fear the council are damned if they do, damned if they don't on this one. And if they had tried to take a preemptive approach, they would have spent millions putting a station box outside the Gresham, only o find that the favoured location for the O'Connell St station is now at the other end of the street.

04-09-2006, 09:28	#12
colmoc Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 140	what I cant understand is why the local councils dont force service provider companies (telco's, cable TV, esb, gas, water, sewerage ... ) to at least cooperate on digging up streets and relaying them. I have seen streets newly laid in tarmac only for "Sierra" to dig it up a week later to put cables in then badly cover it up and leave man holes which are 5-10 cm below/above road level this carry on is leathal to any cyclist and ruins cars tyres and suspension. Why cant they all use the same tunnel network like in paris ??