The Leap Card Thread

[James Howard]

These second journeys should be entirely free unless they are in the opposite direction on the same route. For the customer, it isn't a second journey - it is the second part of the one journey.

Making people pay to complete their journey only provides a disincentive for the operator to make journeys more convenient for customers by providing direct routes. Effectively the customer getting better service is paying less.

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by James Howard

These second journeys should be entirely free unless they are in the opposite direction on the same route. For the customer, it isn't a second journey - it is the second part of the one journey.

Making people pay to complete their journey only provides a disincentive for the operator to make journeys more convenient for customers by providing direct routes. Effectively the customer getting better service is paying less.

Like everything else it boils down to funding from government - we get what we pay for.

Making the second journey free would reduce farebox revenues and squeeze the operating companies' finances even tighter.

I totally agree with your view by the way but until the politicians and ergo the population at large decides that they are prepared to pay proper levels of funding for public transport in this country you are only going to see very slow and gradual change.

[James Howard]

Obviously it would need to be paid for but in the long term, it would probably increase farebox revenue by making public transport more attractive. The fare system cannot continue to muddle on as it is now and somebody in power needs to grasp this nettle.

There is an obvious opportunity to see how this works with the forthcoming opening of Luas BXD. With the appropriate fare structure this represents a fantastic opportunity to open up the south city centre to Maynooth commuters. But I suspect that this will be business as usual and a huge part of the potential of this piece of infrastructure will be lost.

[James Shields]

I agree. Broombridge currently has very low usage at present. If the new station works, the majority of users are likely to be transferring between Luas and Commuter Train (and hopefully eventually DART).

Irish Rail and RPA should see that paying two fares, even if they're on one integrated ticket, is a major disincentive to transferring, and it doesn't take a very big disincentive to make people decide they'll just take their car into town.

So by IE and RPA being unwilling to accept a small loss of revenue from a combined fare, both lose out on many journeys.

Of course, it's difficult to prove that overall revenue will be increased by combined fares, and I agree it's something that a higher power needs to impose upon them.

James

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by James Shields

I agree. Broombridge currently has very low usage at present. If the new station works, the majority of users are likely to be transferring between Luas and Commuter Train (and hopefully eventually DART).

Irish Rail and RPA should see that paying two fares, even if they're on one integrated ticket, is a major disincentive to transferring, and it doesn't take a very big disincentive to make people decide they'll just take their car into town.

So by IE and RPA being unwilling to accept a small loss of revenue from a combined fare, both lose out on many journeys.

Of course, it's difficult to prove that overall revenue will be increased by combined fares, and I agree it's something that a higher power needs to impose upon them.

James

It's not a case of IE having to accept a small drop in revenue - they've repeatedly had to do this in terms of the introduction of LEAP (which had extra back office costs) and subsidy reductions.

I'm sure they would both be prepared to do it if they were compensated by an increase in their subsidy.

The directors of IE have a responsibility to ensure it is run in a financially sound manner. Shocks to the system aren't affordable any more.

Ultimately we need the politicians to realise that proper public transport in Dublin needs a major increase in funding.

We have got to the point where any changes in fare structures have to be paid by increased subsidy levels.

The NTA set the fares now and it is incumbent upon them to look for funding. However their CEO recently commented that her hands are tied to a degree because of the lack of additional public funds, which is clearly a function of the mess our country's finances are in.

[James Howard]

Yesterday I had to go to Clontarf Road which isn't covered by the point-to-point on my Leapcard. Since I can't tag on in Edgeworthstown I went to barrier in Connolly and asked the guy there what I should do. He first suggested that the simplest thing to do would be to buy a ticket but when I explained that I had an epurse balance on it, he said to go through the barrier without tagging off and just tag on on the other side.

So I did this, and as far as the system was concerned my journey originated in Connolly. During this faff I missed a DART so this all delayed me 15 minutes but no worries as I wasn't in a hurry.

Anyway, when I tagged off in Clontarf road, I got charged the maximum fare so it would basically appear that the system is not set up to allow the use of the ePurse from one of the stations on your point-to-point. I rang leap this morning to sort it out and she refunded the money and suggested that I just not bother tagging on and explain my situation to any ticket checkers I met which seems to be setting me up for a hundred euro fine. Of course when I got to Clontarf road the barrier was open and I could have saved myself 15 minutes and a 10 minute 1890 phone call if I'd just dodged my fare.

Anyway, it would appear that the epurse on my leap card is basically useless for local rail travel in Dublin.

[haddockman]

Why would you be encountering a ticket barrier at Connolly if you are transferring from a Sligo train to a DART?

Don't Sligo trains arrive into platform 4? It should be a simple walk to 5-6-7 without the need to go through a barrier.

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by James Howard

Yesterday I had to go to Clontarf Road which isn't covered by the point-to-point on my Leapcard. Since I can't tag on in Edgeworthstown I went to barrier in Connolly and asked the guy there what I should do. He first suggested that the simplest thing to do would be to buy a ticket but when I explained that I had an epurse balance on it, he said to go through the barrier without tagging off and just tag on on the other side.

So I did this, and as far as the system was concerned my journey originated in Connolly. During this faff I missed a DART so this all delayed me 15 minutes but no worries as I wasn't in a hurry.

Anyway, when I tagged off in Clontarf road, I got charged the maximum fare so it would basically appear that the system is not set up to allow the use of the ePurse from one of the stations on your point-to-point. I rang leap this morning to sort it out and she refunded the money and suggested that I just not bother tagging on and explain my situation to any ticket checkers I met which seems to be setting me up for a hundred euro fine. Of course when I got to Clontarf road the barrier was open and I could have saved myself 15 minutes and a 10 minute 1890 phone call if I'd just dodged my fare.

Anyway, it would appear that the epurse on my leap card is basically useless for local rail travel in Dublin.

LEAP can't cope with a point to point ticket and the epurse together.

It will automatically default to a loaded ticket if one is on the card.

There is no way for the card to know which you want to use at the barrier at a station where both are valid.

This issue can be coped with on the buses as there is the option of human intervention using the driver's ticket machine but that option isn't there for rail.

Oyster in London can get around it by having zones but the current station pairing set up in Dublin doesn't lend itself to facilitating that.

The only way around it is to have a second LEAP card to use the epurse.