interesting Mark, how come? seems a bit harsh...

Commencing Monday March 21st the 0620 Portadown to Newry departs at 0615 arriving Newry 0639.

The suggestion that the proposed service is in some way unsafe is patent nonsense. There is no more risk to passengers than on the Kerry, Galway, Rosslare, Sligo or Westport lines which are not AWS, CAWS, DRA or TPWS fitted.

Presumeably this is a temporary arrangement pending the allocation of AWS/TPWS fitted ICR sets. In the interim elaborate, extensive and largely unnecessary arrangements will be in place to compensate for the absence of these systems. It is frankly farcical that such a simple service extension has generated such manic interest from the safety industry.

Its in breech of UK regulations and is unique in having an exemption, there is no other recorded exemptions of this kind

The basic fact is the train used is unsuitable from a passenger standpoint in comfort and facilities. Both Irish Rail and Translink have trains which comply fully with the regulations which offer greater comfort. It is not what was discussed with the railway companies in 2010

So its a lose lose a uncomfortable train which is not in compliance with the regulation vs a comfortable train which is compliant

There is no end date on the exemption, again unique

Safety is the key and first concern, is this less safe than current, yes, is it less safe than considered acceptable by the safety authorities yes. Has safety been compromised to save money?

I don't know how an agreement like this can be allowed to happon even when they have the right trains that can operate the service.

What will happon next? Will we see IE trains operating to Belfast when the enterprise breaks down.

We'll probably see C4Ks on this route before we see 22Ks at IE's pace :D

edit: If IE used 90mph capable stock rather than, let's say, 70mph 29000s, then based on existing Enterprise timings from Newry-Drogheda the train could leave at about 0652 - and hey, maybe even offer Dundalk or Drogheda people a chance to make the 0650 departure to Belfast. But hey, who needs to make Belfast before 0945, right? Would this exemption even allow northbound carriage of passengers even if IE made time to stop on the way north?

If these trains are considered "unsafe" while operating on the short stretch between Newry and the border, are they equally unsafe when operating on the much longer stretch southwards from the border to Dublin & Bray?

The trains have all the safety gear for Ireland, they don't have the Northern Irish safety equipment. It is a legal requirement to have this equipment but you can beg for a exemption. This to my knowledge is the only exemption ever granted for a scheduled passenger service. Translink probably has acquired the greatest number of exemptions of any rail operator in the UK industry. To make matters confusing Translink applied for the exemption not Irish Rail which again is at odds with the way this is normally done.

For the record the last fatality accidents in both Ireland and Northern Ireland involved trains passing red signals and rear ending a stationary train. Both accidents would have been either prevented or significantly reduced in scale had the equipment existed then

Basically the train Irish Rail are sending up has no equipment fitted which will warn the driver of the next signal (AWS) and which will stop the train if it passes a red signal or approaches a red signal too fast (TPWS). All trains in Northern Ireland require a guard or second driver to be carried as they don't have a secure radio system.

Irish Rail has 6 trains in addition to enterprise which have this equipment but are not using it on this service.

On the Irish side there is continuous notification of the next signal (CAWS), automatic brake if the driver fails to acknowledge and a full positive id radio system. The radio is the secondary safety element if something goes wrong.


Put simply if Irish Rail used the trains with the safety equipment, everyone wins, the train would be significantly more comfortable for passengers, be appropriate for the distance, be faster and would ensure the highest level of safety achievable

Mark, could you please outline for us what role the second driver or guard plays north of the border which gets around the need for secure radio?

The second person is there to protect the train by going back 1.25 miles and laying the detonator caps on the rail if anything untoward happens. Typically they find a lineside phone and call in from there and the signalman protects the train. Basically someone to secure the train and someone to get help

With a secure radio system with full coverage any train can contact the signalman directly, signalman can contact any train he wants directly using the trains ID code as the phone number. The IE system even allows text messages to be sent and can allow direct dial so you can ring a landline from a the cab (fabulously clever for early 1980's).

In Northern Ireland the guard is the conductor as well and closes the doors (even though the driver can). Safety rules requires that if any of the cab safety equipment fails a second 'qualified' person travels with the driver that applies pretty universally the world over

thanks Mark

There seems to be a degree of confusion and mis-information here.

Unless the NIR radio system has changed radically in the last few years, it is not a secure system in the sense that the Irish Rail system is secure. The NIR system is open channel whereas on Irish Rail the transmission is heard only by the train carrying the id selected by the controlling signalman.

In any event the Irish Rail train will presumably have an onboard NIR radio unit while travelling between Dundalk and Newry. This was the standard arrangement for years as until the introduction of dedicated motive power for the Enterprise, no Irish Rail equipment had permanently installed NIR radio.

The purpose of the "second man" is to observe the lineside signals as a backup to the driver to compensate for the absence of AWS.

The Irish Rail train will also apparently carry a guard.

As far as I am aware there is no TPWS in Newry so the absence of TPWS on the 2900s operating to Newry is irrelevant.

The absence of AWS is adequately covered by the presence of a second driver.

Neither AWS nor CAWS will necessarily prevent a train passing a stop signal at danger. If a driver acknowledges the warning he remains in control and the system will not intervene to stop the train. There have been numerous accidents in the UK involving trains fitted with AWS, hence the development of TPWS which will apply the brakes if a train approaches a stop signal faster than allowed. TPWS applies only to signals displaying a stop indication and depending on the speed of an approaching train may not prevent a train passing a stop signal.

The Dundalk/Newry section is fully track circuited and in the event of "anything untoward" the opposite road can be immediately protected using track circuit operating bar.

There is no substantive safety risk in the operation of this service, more than adequate measures have been put in place to address the issues involved in using the 2900s.

From a passenger standpoint the use of a 2900 set is anything but ideal, there should be an 0600 from Belfast using intercity quality stock offering a competitive journey time from Belfast, Lisburn, Lurgan, Portadown, Newry, Dundalk and Drogheda to Dublin. In the interim the new service offers Newry commuters the opportunity to arrive in Dublin before 0900, something which hasn't been possible since 1997.

Translink have advised to me that this service will not carry a guard from Newry.

Legally they must carry a guard or second driver with them while within Northern Ireland as all Northern Irish trains do. As there are no guards based in Dundalk it must be a second driver

The second person is the guard or conductor. If the guard is not present in the cab speed is limited to 40mph due lack of the required safety equipment

Newry station is fitted with AWS at the very least. CAWS cab equipment is being upgraded to enforce speed restrictions. Unlike AWS it does show the actual signal not green/caution. At Newry two trains will approach the station from opposite ends. Both will have to swap tracks at some point and therein is the risk of a conflict. NIR radio coverage is considered poor, and not suitable for safety critical communications and is to be replaced with GSM-R and that will remove the conductor requirement. See Downhill accident train was uncontactable due to a gap in coverage.

Fact is both NIR and IE have a fleet of trains which meet the safety requirements and would allow for a fast service to Dublin calling all stops to Gormonston, then non stop overtaking the trains ahead at Mosney and Skerries to deliver something close to an express time

It is scheduled as a 25 minute trip to Dundalk now as apposed to the general 18 minute so presumably this means it is going to travel at the speed restriction.

On another note, Ken McKnigh today advised that this is a Newry to Dublin Connolly only service! Can anyone clarify?

Ken McKnight isn't terribly clued in, it goes to Bray and Newry booking office can issue a ticket to Bray if asked though Ken will say they can't

The train is limited to 70mph and the schedule implies a 40mph speed limit until the border is crossed

Its Monday to Friday only no service on Saturday

I am aware of this, but they say they cant issue a season ticket (ie. weekly or monthly)?

The agreed matrix beyond Dublin City only has single/returns

The Irish Rail taxsaver office will happily quote from all Enterprise stations to any Irish Rail station if asked.

Newry - Connolly €3,180 €318.00
Portadown - Connolly €3,560.00 €356.00

Will take an extra 23 mins between both stations, then with a 2 minute stop in Dundalk.

Newry to Connolly NIR £216 / €250(ish) considerably cheaper and as my employer does not entertain the taxsaver tickets for some bizarre reason, i would prefer to keep the €70ish difference in my pocket.
Issue still reamins that this 06:45 from Newry being heralded as a commuter service does not offer Newry passengers the same commuting enjoyments our counterparts some 15 miles away in Dundalk enjoy on this exact same service and provides us only with the same ticketing opportunities the Enterprise does, therefore is nothing more than an uncomfortable, extra stops intercity service to Dublin Connolly with the optional free onward transport to Tara and Pearse.