Rail Users Ireland Forum

Go Back   Rail Users Ireland Forum > Irish Rail Customer Service Issues > Commuter Services > Longford-Maynooth-Dunboyne-Clonsilla-Dublin line
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Unread 08-10-2013, 18:15   #1
lambo77
Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 40
Angry Slow Service

Has anyone noticed the slower service recently in both directions on the sligo - connolly line. There seem to be a few new speed restrctiions between Killucan and Enfield.

Anybody know what they are?/

lambo77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 08-10-2013, 20:20   #2
Jamie2k9
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,146
Default

Quote:
Has anyone noticed the slower service recently in both directions on the sligo - connolly line. There seem to be a few new speed restrctiions between Killucan and Enfield.

Anybody know what they are?/
It could be anything to be honest, small section or rail may need replacing, track bed need to fixed, track alignment issue are the main causes of TSR. It could be fixed within days, weeks or months just depends on what it is and weather its a major safety threat.
Jamie2k9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 04:26   #3
Colm Moore
Local Liaison Officer
 
Colm Moore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,442
Default

Leaf fall season and passing loops?
__________________
Colm Moore is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 06:49   #4
James Howard
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
James Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sligo Line
Posts: 1,115
Default

The 545 from Sligo was close to 10 minutes late Monday and Tuesday this week. Monday morning was delayed before Edgeworthstown and Tuesday was due to a Maynooth service running late.

As Colm suggested, I suspect it is leaf fall and the dire lack of passing loops between Maynooth and Mullingar that make it impossible to recover delays.
James Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 08:16   #5
grainne whale
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Celbridge
Posts: 259
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colm Moore View Post
Leaf fall season and passing loops?
Gosh, however do they manage in other countries.
grainne whale is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 08:40   #6
berneyarms
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 602
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grainne whale View Post
Gosh, however do they manage in other countries.
Several lines in Britain have special leaf fall timetables that add extra time to the journey to account for the wheelslip problem.

That particular problem is something all rail operators have to face.
berneyarms is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 09:23   #7
James Howard
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
James Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sligo Line
Posts: 1,115
Default

Given how padded the Irish Rail timetables are already, I would rather they just do their best with the existing timetables rather than just have them waiting around even longer to catch up with the timetable when things actually go right.

My morning train takes 102 minutes for 69 miles using an ICR as it is currently with 5 stops. How much longer should it take?
James Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 09:23   #8
grainne whale
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Celbridge
Posts: 259
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by berneyarms View Post
Several lines in Britain have special leaf fall timetables that add extra time to the journey to account for the wheelslip problem.

That particular problem is something all rail operators have to face.
No actually I'm talking about countries with a large areas of deciduous trees. ie USA - New England.
grainne whale is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 09:29   #9
berneyarms
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 602
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grainne whale View Post
No actually I'm talking about countries with a large areas of deciduous trees. ie USA - New England.
They all have the same problem - this is not something specific to Ireland.
berneyarms is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 10:26   #10
grainne whale
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Celbridge
Posts: 259
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by berneyarms View Post
They all have the same problem - this is not something specific to Ireland.
Fantastic - we can send a spacecraft to the outer reaches of our solar system but we cant solve wheelslip.

Last edited by grainne whale : 10-10-2013 at 08:14.
grainne whale is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 11:05   #11
berneyarms
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 602
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grainne whale View Post
Fantastic - we can send a spacecraft to the outer reaches of our solar system but we can solve wheelslip.
Whether you like it or not, it's the truth - you seem to think that I'm making this up, but I can assure you wheelslip is a problem that every rail operator faces.

Making smart comments about it is not going to change that.
berneyarms is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 11:11   #12
grainne whale
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Celbridge
Posts: 259
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by berneyarms View Post
Whether you like it or not, it's the truth - you seem to think that I'm making this up, but I can assure you wheelslip is a problem that every rail operator faces.

Making smart comments about it is not going to change that.
I'm only stating the obvious

Last edited by grainne whale : 10-10-2013 at 08:12.
grainne whale is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 13:31   #13
James Howard
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
James Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sligo Line
Posts: 1,115
Default

Leaf-slip is a problem in other countries (See wikipedia) but it is particularly bad in Ireland and Britain because of the amount of rain we get around the time leaves are falling.

The delays are nowhere near as bad as they were a few years ago when Irish Rail were using locomotives on the Sligo line but when you have a single line railway where most trains have to cross with two others, knock-on delays are inevitable when you have poor traction.

The only real way to deal with it would be to provide more crossing points to mitigate knock-on delays or to run trains to clean off the leaves with high-pressure water or steam. One thing that would help at a relatively low cost would be to get the second platform at Enfield back in action so that it could be used as an unscheduled crossing-point.
James Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 13:49   #14
Jamie2k9
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,146
Default

Quote:
One thing that would help at a relatively low cost would be to get the second platform at Enfield back in action so that it could be used as an unscheduled crossing-point.
Was there not a threat on here a while ago saying plans were being made to reopen it?

Do all trains have to stop here or could you get by crossing trains there with one stopping and one not.
Jamie2k9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 15:16   #15
James Howard
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
James Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sligo Line
Posts: 1,115
Default

I thought I had heard that they were planning on sorting out Enfield but perhaps I am wrong.

They used to cross the 1700 from Sligo with the 17:15 to Longford at Enfield and it wasn't treated as a stop for the up-train.

But currently no trains are timetabled to cross at Enfield so it can't be used without reversing one of the trains. That leaves the choice between Maynooth and Killucan which incurs an extra 15 - 20 minute delay for one of the trains or reversing a train back into Enfield.

Last edited by James Howard : 09-10-2013 at 15:17. Reason: Missing line
James Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 17:39   #16
Mark Gleeson
Technical Officer
 
Mark Gleeson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Coach C, Seat 33
Posts: 12,669
Default

Folks lets keep things calm.

Wheelslip is a real and serious problem which has not been resolved and won't be as the laws of physics say transferring several hundred horsepower trough a contact area of about the size of a 1 cent coin is not going to work terribly well if you add anything which lubricates the patch, water, crushed leaves, oil etc.

As always Irish Rail are not exactly showing the way in addressing this issue
Mark Gleeson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-10-2013, 19:54   #17
Inniskeen
Really Regular Poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 951
Default

Yes the same physics which make the steel wheel on a steel rail so efficient is also an Achilles heel when it comes to leaf fall and other rail contaminants.

While the issue is not unique to Ireland, the problem here (and in the UK) has become more acute in recent years as modern braking sytems do not act directly on the wheels but are a combination of dynamic braking and axle mounted discs. Older brake sytems actually cleaned the wheels and removed contaminants, something which newer systems do not do.

While not a complete solution most modern braking and traction control systems worldwide incorporate automatic sanding systems. The reason locomotive hauled trains on Irish Rail were (and remain) particularly susceptible to leaf fall is that Irish Rail have been traditionally very reluctant to use locomotive sanding equipment. In some countries it is illegal and impractical to operate a train without a fully functional sanding system to support both traction and braking.
Inniskeen is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-10-2013, 01:01   #18
Jamie2k9
Really Really Regluar Poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,146
Default

Wheelslip is not such a major issue however this time of year it gets a lot of attention. Every single delay is blamed on this for the next few weeks when probably out of 100% at most 30-40% will actually be this. Its an good excuse as passengers get very p*ssed off hearing its signalling etc and this time of year takes the heat of IE.

Wheelslip is very rarely an issue on Waterford route, there is largely no tall trees that drop leafs left on the route, IE always do major cutting of ditches during the summer. The only spot where it can be a problem sometimes in in Carlow station (Waterford end) where there is no trees next to the line as such but wind blows them onto the tracks and departing trains have some problems.

I expect its the same on most routes out of Heuston.
Jamie2k9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-10-2013, 01:47   #19
haddockman
Regular Poster
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 113
Default

Where is the sandite train?
haddockman is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 23-10-2013, 12:26   #20
JohnnyBoy
New to the board
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 27
Default

Pretty certain that leaf slip is not the issue in this case. The train is obviously braking at the same place each day. Maybe there are track issues. It does also pass a level crossing during its slow phase, so maybe it's something to do with that. Glad I'm not the only person it's bothering.
JohnnyBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:23.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.