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Unread 09-01-2012, 20:36   #1
2200DMU
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Default Line Speeds

Is it possible to get a complete breakdown of the line speed between Waterford - Heuston.

Permanent Speed Restrictions - why don't Irish Rail fix the problem instead of haveing permanent Speed Restrictions. Are they just a quick fix instead of actually spending money on fixing the line.

On another note, many people in the South East say any increase in fares on the line will lead to a further decline in Passengers.
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Unread 09-01-2012, 20:45   #2
Mark Gleeson
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If you have a legitimate need for the line speeds you can ask Irish Rail and they will quite happily give you a copy of the latest numbers.

Despite the scare stories, Irish Rail's passengers numbers are actually holding firm at a time where Dublin Bus and Bus Eireann are in serious trouble. Numbers in 2010 were close to 2 million above the target agreed with the NTA, Irish Rail is still ahead of 2005 numbers while Dublin Bus is back to 2001 ish era

Rosslare, Westport and to a lesser degree Sligo are doing quite well. Western Rail Corridor on the other hand is a mess
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Unread 09-01-2012, 21:10   #3
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I think that the Network Statement agreed with the NTA (?) gives a lot of detail, including line speeds and permanent restrictions en route. Don't have a link to hand unfortunately, but I've seen it online somewhere.
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Unread 09-01-2012, 21:13   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson View Post
If you have a legitimate need for the line speeds you can ask Irish Rail and they will quite happily give you a copy of the latest numbers.

Despite the scare stories, Irish Rail's passengers numbers are actually holding firm at a time where Dublin Bus and Bus Eireann are in serious trouble. Numbers in 2010 were close to 2 million above the target agreed with the NTA, Irish Rail is still ahead of 2005 numbers while Dublin Bus is back to 2001 ish era

Rosslare, Westport and to a lesser degree Sligo are doing quite well. Western Rail Corridor on the other hand is a mess
Over the past few months, there has been a noticeable increase in loadings on some trains. For example the 0600 from Waterford and 0515 from Westport. In the past there was no problem getting a seat but now these trains, especially the 3-car Westport (should really be 6-car), are quite full from Kildare/Newbridge.
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Unread 10-01-2012, 14:51   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson View Post
If you have a legitimate need for the line speeds you can ask Irish Rail and they will quite happily give you a copy of the latest numbers.

Despite the scare stories, Irish Rail's passengers numbers are actually holding firm at a time where Dublin Bus and Bus Eireann are in serious trouble. Numbers in 2010 were close to 2 million above the target agreed with the NTA, Irish Rail is still ahead of 2005 numbers while Dublin Bus is back to 2001 ish era

Rosslare, Westport and to a lesser degree Sligo are doing quite well. Western Rail Corridor on the other hand is a mess
Hope your right about the numbers - what is visible on the ground suggests that patronage on most services are struggling severely. Don't see anthing growing at present. Many services, including DART and Dublin suburban, appear to be anything between 30% and 50% down on a few years ago.
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Unread 10-01-2012, 17:14   #6
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To follow up my earlier post and to reply the the original point made about permanent speed restrictions. First the link to the Network statement (which is very informative): https://irishrail.ie/upload/IE_Netwo...ement_2011.pdf

Second: if you take the Waterford line, the overall line maximum is 80mph. The permanent restrictions are largely due to curvature and are not really capable of being changed all that much, e.g. 30mph through Carlow; 60 and 50 mph at the main junction at Lavistown (depending on route); 50 through Thomastown and 70 in places between Thomastown and Waterford. There are also limits on the approaches to Carlow, Kilkenny and Waterford for safety reasons (it is not considered wise to go from 80 to 30 in one go).
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Unread 10-01-2012, 18:04   #7
2200DMU
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Quote:
60 and 50 mph at the main junction at Lavistown (depending on route);
Its down to 25 inbound and outbound at the junction for trains to/from Waterford at Lavistown and less than 50 for Dublin side.

Quote:
(it is not considered wise to go from 80 to 30 in one go).
If so why does it drop from 70-80 miles to 25 all of a sudden approching the Lavistown J from Thomastwon side and many times the driver can't get the train down to 25 in time as ends up going way faster over the junction. The 25mph sign is seconds before the juction and you would think that somebody pulled the emergency brake.
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Unread 10-01-2012, 19:21   #8
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anecdotal evidence is that the Cork commuter line numbers are up significantly
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Unread 10-01-2012, 20:14   #9
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Numbers in Cork are quite good, the peak hour service in Cork is comparable if not better than many Dublin stations.
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Unread 10-01-2012, 21:08   #10
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2200DMU: The 25 through Lavistown is obviously "temporary", but as is often the case it take quite a while before an old turnout or crossover is replaced. The universal practice on Irish Rail is to place a warning sign about 1.25 miles in advance of a TSR. This is adequate, especially as the weekly circular also notifies TSRs.
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Unread 10-01-2012, 21:15   #11
2200DMU
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Quote:
2200DMU: The 25 through Lavistown is obviously "temporary", but as is often the case it take quite a while before an old turnout or crossover is replaced. The universal practice on Irish Rail is to place a warning sign about 1.25 miles in advance of a TSR. This is adequate, especially as the weekly circular also notifies TSRs.
Its being there for well over a year and a half if not longer.
Since the Points Incident with the 15.05 (mark 3) Heuston-Waterford a few years back they have reduced speed and then when the 2200 started there was problems with them at the junction so it was reduced further and now its 25mph.

Same at Cherryville. Trains take the junction at 20mph, was much faster before. This is still after work was done on the junction.

Last edited by 2200DMU : 10-01-2012 at 21:19.
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Unread 11-04-2012, 16:24   #12
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There have being improvments in speed between Waterford-Kilkenny over the last 2 weeks. The most notable change is Mullinavat where the 25 mph restriction have bieng lifted and speed is now 60 mph. Overall its 80mph except fot a small 70mph section. From all services I have being on time savings between Waterford-Thomastown are 3-4 mins. All restrictions between Thomastwon-Lavistown J are lifted and its mainly 80 mph.

Last edited by Jamie2k9 : 11-04-2012 at 16:30.
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Unread 11-04-2012, 16:50   #13
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That's good news - hopefully this acceleration will be reflected in the next revision of the public timetable.
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Unread 11-04-2012, 17:28   #14
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When is the next version of the timetable coming out? Are we loking at December?
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Unread 11-04-2012, 17:41   #15
2200DMU
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According to website current timetable is valid until 1 September.

Check any date after 1 September and :

Quote:
Timetable valid from 25/09/2011 to 01/09/2012.

Last edited by 2200DMU : 11-04-2012 at 17:44.
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Unread 11-04-2012, 20:07   #16
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The website merely rolls the date forward so do not attach any significance to the date it gives.
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Unread 12-04-2012, 13:39   #17
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Because the IE website upgrade broke a lot of existing links including the Network Statement I have uploaded it to Scribd. Obviously some of the info in it is going to be stale because of upgrade work done in 2011 but some may find it helpful when trying to understand stuff like why Rosslare 22K trains can't be 6 car length etc.

Interestingly it lists the Roscrea 2nd platform as active which is presumably an oversight on whoever compiled the data's part since we know from the issues around the new evening services that that platform is not in use. It was a draft admittedly but they never did upload the final version. Hopefully IE will get around to publishing another some time in the next decade.
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Unread 22-04-2012, 22:03   #18
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.

Last edited by josephpatrickobrien : 28-08-2019 at 09:56.
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Unread 07-05-2012, 21:17   #19
2200DMU
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There was a sign saying 90 mph between Cherryville-Athy. Only saw it today and it was 90 and not the limit of 80. Are they plans to increase it to 90 as its good quality track and no bends. Drivers are always putting on the breaks to keep within the 80mph limit which is annyoing as they go to slow one minute and then go to fast the next.
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Unread 07-05-2012, 22:17   #20
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Its just part of the 8 missing from the sign.
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