DB sell rail tickets!!!!

Derek Wheeler · 09-03-2007, 00:05

I know Im banned for a while, but I just read this on boards;

Quote:

Introduction of a new Route 93 Bus/Rail shuttle service

Dublin Bus is pleased to announce the introduction of a new Route 93 Bus/Rail shuttle service from Monday 12th March . The service connects with trains to and from the new Docklands Rail Station and the City Centre.

From Docklands
Docklands Rail Station; North Wall Quay; Tara Street Dart Station

From City Centre
Eden Quay; North Wall Quay; Docklands Rail Station.

Fare: Adult €1.20 and Child €0.70

A combined bus and rail ticket to Broombridge, Ashtown, Castleknock, Coolmine or Clonsilla may be purchased on the bus.

Now correct me if Im wrong, but if I board a 90 bus on eden quay, I can't buy a through rail ticket to anywhere out of Heuston. Arriving in Heuston, I have to hope (or requested from my departing station) that my rail ticket entitles me to "local travel" in Dublin. (as some hardchaw on boards.ie said)

So before I take out the shotgun and burst through the door of boards.ie, can somebody explain why DB can do this and is it a case of "pulling out all the stops" for a rail station that was only built to satisfy planning provisos in west Dublin? Perhaps Im not being "PC" (despite the pitiful ravings of a boards.ie lunatic, I do know what it actually means) or conformist enough to grasp this wonderfully new "integrated" package.

Rail tickets are card with stripe. Bus tickets are paper. Whats the story rory??? Exit validation anyone????

Mark Gleeson · 09-03-2007, 00:07

Its been ongoing for years on the 102 and 114 buses

Derek Wheeler · 09-03-2007, 00:13

I know we talked about this Mark, but for the benefit of those who want integrated ticketing and for those who have to actually "ask" for a "city centre" ticket when travelling to Heuston, please enlighten us all how it can work, but isn't rolled out nationwide within the CIE group.

Mark Gleeson · 09-03-2007, 14:11

Unfortunately it doesn't work way to many problems

1. For any fare beyond the short hop zone (10-18 miles out) would require notes, DB don't take notes nor will they

2. Dublin Bus don't issue mag stripe tickets on bus -> entry/exit validation

3. Current options are limited to a tiny set of routes, and the bus can only issue a restricted sub set of destinations. eg 114 to Maynooth line doesn't work

4. Dublin Bus don't issue return tickets important as rail tickets cheaper by return

5. It bypasses IE yield management (ie cheaper fares) and reservations

6. It would cause a massive slow down in boarding and would likely raise a demarkation issue with unions

7. Online ticketing and print your own will make intercity rail travel a lot easier, and we know thats being looked at

Solution

Zonal system with all tickets valid on all modes, even with smart cards cash fares on bus won't be able to do this as they hit exit validation on IE, London hasn't cracked this one either. Problem with zonal is Heuston will be a zonal boundary so to cross it you will continue to pay extra, this is common elsewhere I'm afraid,

luasifer · 11-03-2007, 23:34

Heuston does not necesserily have to be a zonal boundary. It depends where the zones are set. Look at the central zone in Paris, it covers the whole metro almost, then the RER goes out into the outer zones. Compared to the luas central zone Paris zone 1 is huge.

I dont think it is necessary for all intercity tickets to heuston to have zone 1 travel. This is not the case in Paris or London, Paris being the best benchmark in my opinion. It would only be local or suburban trains that would automatically include local transport. Intercity could still have an optional add on.

This is not rocket science, I wish they would get the finger out and sort it out. We are penalised enough on the Kildare line as it is.

Colm Moore · 13-03-2007, 21:19

Quote:

Fare: Adult €1.20

This seems to be a premium fare. So some deal has been done.

alek smart · 14-03-2007, 13:57

Well spotted Victor.
The fare structure is outside of the normal Departmental approved PSO one so I suspect this service may well be one contracted in by IE.
However as it is also selling Rail Valid tickets it would appear to be a "Feeder" service
Something not quite kosher about this wee route.....more to follow methinks ??

Mark Gleeson · 14-03-2007, 14:02

Fare is the same as the 90/91/92 (for the city only section) thus it matched the IE fares matrix

Indeed a ticket bought from Clonsilla to Dublin Bus Luas 90 will be valid on the 90/91/92/93 and even the Luas also means the student weekly and monthly rail only is valid as well

Oisin88 · 14-03-2007, 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

Fare is the same as the 90/91/92 (for the city only section) thus it matched the IE fares matrix

Indeed a ticket bought from Clonsilla to Dublin Bus Luas 90 will be valid on the 90/91/92/93 and even the Luas also means the student weekly and monthly rail only is valid as well

91 has sadly passed away (not that anyone cares/noticed)

kevin · 15-03-2007, 11:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oisin88

91 has sadly passed away (not that anyone cares/noticed)

I don't think the 91 was a scheduled service. It's still mentioned at the bottom of the 90 route page.

Also I think I saw one arrive at heuston this morning.

kevin

Oisin88 · 15-03-2007, 21:48

I see, so Route 91 is a footnote on the 90:

Quote:

Route 91 - To and from City Centre and Heuston Station only. This service operates in conjuction with train arrivals and departures from Heuston Station.

i.e. we make it up as we go along if the bus driver that feels like driving a 91 is rostered on for that day.

meanwhile, put "91" into "search by route number" and you get http://www.dublinbus.ie/your_journey...r.asp?route=91

Quote:

No Such Route exists!!

Colm Moore · 19-03-2007, 04:22

I suspect a lot of 91s are Conyngham Road based buses being pre-positioned into the city centre.

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09-03-2007, 00:07	#2
Mark Gleeson Technical Officer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Coach C, Seat 33 Posts: 12,669	Its been ongoing for years on the 102 and 114 buses

09-03-2007, 00:13	#3
Derek Wheeler Registered user Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kildare Posts: 1,555	I know we talked about this Mark, but for the benefit of those who want integrated ticketing and for those who have to actually "ask" for a "city centre" ticket when travelling to Heuston, please enlighten us all how it can work, but isn't rolled out nationwide within the CIE group.

09-03-2007, 14:11	#4
Mark Gleeson Technical Officer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Coach C, Seat 33 Posts: 12,669	Unfortunately it doesn't work way to many problems 1. For any fare beyond the short hop zone (10-18 miles out) would require notes, DB don't take notes nor will they 2. Dublin Bus don't issue mag stripe tickets on bus -> entry/exit validation 3. Current options are limited to a tiny set of routes, and the bus can only issue a restricted sub set of destinations. eg 114 to Maynooth line doesn't work 4. Dublin Bus don't issue return tickets important as rail tickets cheaper by return 5. It bypasses IE yield management (ie cheaper fares) and reservations 6. It would cause a massive slow down in boarding and would likely raise a demarkation issue with unions 7. Online ticketing and print your own will make intercity rail travel a lot easier, and we know thats being looked at Solution Zonal system with all tickets valid on all modes, even with smart cards cash fares on bus won't be able to do this as they hit exit validation on IE, London hasn't cracked this one either. Problem with zonal is Heuston will be a zonal boundary so to cross it you will continue to pay extra, this is common elsewhere I'm afraid,

11-03-2007, 23:34	#5
luasifer Regular Poster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 37	Heuston does not necesserily have to be a zonal boundary. It depends where the zones are set. Look at the central zone in Paris, it covers the whole metro almost, then the RER goes out into the outer zones. Compared to the luas central zone Paris zone 1 is huge. I dont think it is necessary for all intercity tickets to heuston to have zone 1 travel. This is not the case in Paris or London, Paris being the best benchmark in my opinion. It would only be local or suburban trains that would automatically include local transport. Intercity could still have an optional add on. This is not rocket science, I wish they would get the finger out and sort it out. We are penalised enough on the Kildare line as it is.

14-03-2007, 13:57	#7
alek smart Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 144	Well spotted Victor. The fare structure is outside of the normal Departmental approved PSO one so I suspect this service may well be one contracted in by IE. However as it is also selling Rail Valid tickets it would appear to be a "Feeder" service Something not quite kosher about this wee route.....more to follow methinks ??

14-03-2007, 14:02	#8
Mark Gleeson Technical Officer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Coach C, Seat 33 Posts: 12,669	Fare is the same as the 90/91/92 (for the city only section) thus it matched the IE fares matrix Indeed a ticket bought from Clonsilla to Dublin Bus Luas 90 will be valid on the 90/91/92/93 and even the Luas also means the student weekly and monthly rail only is valid as well

19-03-2007, 04:22	#12
Colm Moore Local Liaison Officer Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,442	I suspect a lot of 91s are Conyngham Road based buses being pre-positioned into the city centre.