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Unread 19-05-2015, 18:04   #1
Mickey H
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Default 0615 ex Cork nonstop to Dublin

This will start next Monday (25th) and arrives in Heuston at 0830. It runs Monday to Friday only with no opposite working
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Unread 19-05-2015, 18:17   #2
Jamie2k9
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06.00 moves to 05.55 and arrives at 08.20
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Unread 19-05-2015, 18:27   #3
berneyarms
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Full changes:
06:00 Cork-Heuston advanced to 05:55 and accelerated arriving at 08:20
04:55 Tralee-Mallow (MO) advanced to 04:50
06:15 Cork-Heuston non-stop additional service (arriving 08:30)
05:15 Westport-Heuston deferred to 05:25 arriving Heuston at 08:30
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Unread 19-05-2015, 20:27   #4
Jamie2k9
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While it's good to see services being added I can't help but think it's really a PR/market stunt and will not deliver much in the line of revenue/passenger growth.

Personally I would scrap the current 06.00 and replace it with the 06.15 service and have it serve Mallow only. Will make less than 30 seconds time delay and can easily be absorbed into the 5 minutes recovery time build into the 06.15 service. Mallow speed restricted as far as I know.

Charleville can be served by the 07.00 instead, can't see numbers being high and able to absorb the 1.5 minutes or so.

The 06.25 connection to the old 06.00 should be a direct Dublin service taking 2 hours serving Limerick Junction only. The 06.40 is regularly full to capacity by Portlaoise etc so while it's possible give those commuters seats from Kildare when there is some to go around.

So
06.15 - 08.30 - Cork-Dublin (Mallow)
06.20 - 08.20 - Limerick-Dublin (Limerick Junction)

So what we will now have is the:
05.55 service leaving Cork empty, 20-30 Mallow, handful at Charleville, 20-30 at Limerick J - 4 coach (265)
06.15 service leaving Cork with at most 80 - 3 coach (190)

Numbers are rough estimates but online bookings have being used as a guide and if I am being honest I am being overly kind with numbers I suspect.

IE will not increase revenue/passengers for a 15 minutes extra in bed.

Any thoughts???

Last edited by Jamie2k9 : 19-05-2015 at 20:29.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 21:33   #5
Kilocharlie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berneyarms View Post
Full changes:
06:00 Cork-Heuston advanced to 05:55 and accelerated arriving at 08:20
04:55 Tralee-Mallow (MO) advanced to 04:50
06:15 Cork-Heuston non-stop additional service (arriving 08:30)
05:15 Westport-Heuston deferred to 05:25 arriving Heuston at 08:30
Note both the 0615 and the 0525 both arrive at 0830! Suspect there will be revisions to the 0525 timings.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 21:36   #6
berneyarms
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Originally Posted by Kilocharlie View Post
Note both the 0615 and the 0525 both arrive at 0830! Suspect there will be revisions to the 0525 timings.
I suspect that one of them has recovery time built into the schedule and will arrive ahead of that.

But given there are three tracks from Inchicore to Heuston, it's not impossible for two trains to arrive at the same time.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 21:45   #7
Jamie2k9
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I suspect that one of them has recovery time built into the schedule and will arrive ahead of that.

But given there are three tracks from Inchicore to Heuston, it's not impossible for two trains to arrive at the same time.
Won't make a difference if both were on time one would be held at Park West, 06.15 will overtake 05.15 at Kildare and should make it in by 08.25.

Could be a little trickey at Limerick Junction with around 5 minutes gap with the 05.55, 06.15 and 06.40 operating. Cutting it tight as the 15 minutes saving are being knocked off between Cork-Limerick J.

Last edited by Jamie2k9 : 19-05-2015 at 21:53.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 21:54   #8
Kilocharlie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berneyarms View Post
I suspect that one of them has recovery time built into the schedule and will arrive ahead of that.

But given there are three tracks from Inchicore to Heuston, it's not impossible for two trains to arrive at the same time.
There are only two tracks from Park-West to Inchicore and 3 from there on. Whichever one gets the track at Kildare will lead all the way. A Portloaise service occupies the slow line.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 21:58   #9
berneyarms
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilocharlie View Post
There are only two tracks from Park-West to Inchicore and 3 from there on. Whichever one gets the track at Kildare will lead all the way. A Portloaise service occupies the slow line.
But one of the trains could be scheduled to take longer from Inchicore than the other - depending upon platform availability for example.

It could still be overtaken between Inchicore and Heuston.
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Unread 19-05-2015, 22:01   #10
berneyarms
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie2k9 View Post
Won't make a difference if both were on time one would be held at Park West, 06.15 will overtake 05.15 at Kildare and should make it in by 08.25.

Could be a little trickey at Limerick Junction with around 5 minutes gap with the 05.55, 06.15 and 06.40 operating. Cutting it tight as the 15 minutes saving are being knocked off between Cork-Limerick J.
How do you know where the time is being "knocked off"?

There is no publically available information about the running times on the non-stop service apart from the departure and arrival times.

Edit - I can see that it has to pass Limerick Junction at around 07:00 or so (to remain ahead of the 06:40 ex-Limerick), which means taking 45 minutes rather than the 56 that the 0700 takes with 2 station stops - that's only about 10 minutes

Last edited by berneyarms : 19-05-2015 at 22:18.
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Unread 20-05-2015, 11:00   #11
Mark Gleeson
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For all the talk, the train is going in the wrong direction...

What is really needed is a 06:00 Dublin Cork, call Limerick Junc, Charleville & Mallow, arrive 08:35 ish
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Unread 20-05-2015, 12:31   #12
berneyarms
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Realistically a timetable recast is needed on the Heuston side to allow for:
- An extra 06:00 Heuston/Cork
- Better spacing of early Cork/Heuston trains
- Elimination of commuter stops on Intercity trains
- Improved peak commuter services
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Unread 20-05-2015, 14:14   #13
Jamie2k9
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Quote:
- Elimination of commuter stops on Intercity trains
- Improved peak commuter services
Well if you want to increase Intericty journey times, not practical to fully remove stops.

Each route has:
First departures 05.00-06.00 serving most commuter stations
Second departure, good express with no commuter stops
Third departure, one commuter station

Removing them is not fully practical and could lead to major revenue losses for IE!
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Unread 20-05-2015, 14:15   #14
laoisfan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson View Post
For all the talk, the train is going in the wrong direction...

What is really needed is a 06:00 Dublin Cork, call Limerick Junc, Charleville & Mallow, arrive 08:35 ish
Thurles?

For those of us at Ballybrophy, Cork is every bit commutable as Dublin is. Even a drive down to Thurles to hop on the train to Cork to work in Cork City Centre or Mahon Business Park is doable and on par with commutes to Dublin (City Center, East Point Business Park etc etc).
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Unread 20-05-2015, 15:26   #15
Mark Gleeson
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Its 100 miles to Cork from Ballybrophy, totally crazy to commute and not something you want to encourage. Neither of the early Cork Dublin trains call Thurles.

Its a commercial choice, more stops means more time. The absence of a pre 9am arrival in Cork is a disgrace and has serious implications for business.
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Unread 20-05-2015, 16:38   #16
berneyarms
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The two Cork/Dublin trains have no need to call at Thurles as the early Limerick fills that gap.

I would think having a Thurles stop on a southbound 06:00 Dublin/Cork would be a sensible idea - it would also have a potential for students travelling to UCC.

Four stops should be doable in 2 hours 35 mins.
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Unread 20-05-2015, 19:42   #17
James Howard
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There are plenty of people around me in Longford driving do-lally commutes to places like Galway, Thurles, etc. If the rail routing allows it and it's on a fast line 100 miles is not unreasonable and if the service isn't provided by rail, people will drive it.

At the moment, people in their prime career years living in the country have to put up with stupid commutes because it almost impossible to sell a house for more than is owed on it (at least in less than a 12 months or so). Hence, if Irish Rail can make it easier at a reasonable cost, why not.
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Unread 21-05-2015, 11:32   #18
Jamie2k9
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http://www.irishrail.ie/news/corkdublinexpress
Quote:
New 06.15hrs Cork to Dublin non-stop Express service begins Mon 25th May

21 May 2015

The new service will have a journey time of 2 hours 15 minutes, arriving in Dublin Heuston at 08.30hrs. Minor changes to some other services also.

We are delighted to introduce a new non-stop express service daily (Monday to Friday):

06.15hrs from Cork’s Kent Station to Dublin Heuston, with a journey time of 2 hours 15 minutes, arriving in Heuston Station at 08.30hrs.
The new service operates from Monday 25th May onwards, and is being introduced following the approval of the National Transport Authority.

The new express service is being introduced following customer research, with a particular demand identified for a faster morning service arriving in Dublin at 08.30hrs, to facilitate business meeting needs.

This will be the only non-stop service of its type on our national network, and will enable customers to maximise the benefits of travelling with Iarnród Éireann – allowing productive use of time and offering free wifi, charge points for phones at every seat – while giving our best journey time.

We intend for this to be the beginning of a series of continuing journey time improvements, including network upgrades to deliver further speed enhancements on all our services, to ensure the train is the most competitive option for customers

As part of the introduction of the new 06.15hrs Cork to Dublin Express service, the following changes will also be implemented, following the approval of the National Transport Authority:

06.00hrs Cork to Dublin Heuston (Mon-Sat) will now depart at 05.55hrs, and operate 5 to 10 minutes earlier throughout.
04.55hrs Tralee to Mallow (Mon only) will now depart at 04.50hrs, and operate 5 to 8 minutes earlier throughout.
05.15hrs Westport to Dublin Heuston will now depart at 05.25hrs, and operate 6 to 10 minutes later throughout.
08.09hrs Newbridge to Dublin Heuston will now depart at 08.11hrs, and operate 2 minutes later throughout.
06.55hrs Athlone to Dublin Heuston (Sat only) will now depart at 07.05hrs and operate between 6 and 10 minutes later throughout.
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Unread 21-05-2015, 13:36   #19
laoisfan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson View Post
Its 100 miles to Cork from Ballybrophy, totally crazy to commute and not something you want to encourage. Neither of the early Cork Dublin trains call Thurles.

Its a commercial choice, more stops means more time. The absence of a pre 9am arrival in Cork is a disgrace and has serious implications for business.
Would you agree that it's roughly 73 miles (thereabout) from Ballybrophy to Dublin?

If so....100 miles....73 miles....totally doable. I know people who drive up/down every day from Ballybrophy/Rathdowney to Cork. And I'm talking Cork City Centre here. Also Thurles.

Irish Rail seem to think that all signs point to Dublin. They made that mistake with the line from Limerick to Dublin via Nenagh, Roscrea etc. Smart thing to do might have been to try running it from Portlaoise to Limerick via Ballybrophy, Roscrea, Nenagh etc etc just to see if they could get people out of their cars!!

Edit: I've often have had to get up at 5:30am/6:00am to go into Portlaoise to catch a train to Dublin to make a 8:30am start in Eastpoint. Getting up at this time or a small bit later to drive to Thurles to catch a train to Cork (assuming it made Kent Station at 8:30am at the latest) would not be a big deal.

Ballybrophy-Templemore-Thurles are ideal locations for commuting to Dublin, Limerick & Cork via Irish Rail. Totally doable.

Last edited by laoisfan : 21-05-2015 at 13:39.
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Unread 25-05-2015, 06:56   #20
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At 07.54 the live info shows the 06.15 Cork-Dublin as arriving at Heuston
in 41 minutes time i.e. 08.35.
Possibly it may make up a few minutes.
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