[Article] Serious flaws found in Luas system

[philip]

Originally Posted by Derek Wheeler

Back to 3 examples then?

Just had a look at the DTO aerial photography. Travelling from Tallaght, there's curves on blocks at the following locations;

Medium right hander between Square and Hospital
Medium left hander just after Cookstown
Shallow left hander before Belgard
Medium left hander after Kingswood
Very shallow left hander just before Bluebell

Note that there are NO curves on blocks anywhere inor near the Red Cow Depot/stop. It's all the encased concrete type around there. The stretch where the line dips beneath Rialto bridge is also on blocks. There may be a slight curve here also but it's hard to tell exactly.

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by Irish Independent

Luas shambles: no one told me, says Brennan

Mystery over who knew what about faults at launch
Treacy Hogan and Fionnan Sheahan
FORMER Transport Minister Seamus Brennan claimed he was not told faults were found in the 800m Luas three months before it was rolled out.
However, the Irish Independent has confirmed that two sets of his officials were told of the flaws which will now cost as much as 10m to fix.
The faults were discovered in the bonding material which was laid down under the rail lines connecting them to the blocks.
In large sections of lines this is failing to hold and is causing the blocks surrounding the rails to shift.
The damage is so bad that contractors have told Luas chiefs they will have to rip up one-third of the Luas track, causing massive disruption to repair the problem.
A director of the State's Railway Procurement Agency (RPA) revealed last night that he informed top Department of Transport officials about the problem.
This raises serious questions about who knew what and why the minister responsible was not told.
And it is sure to fuel speculation that the enormous political and public pressure was a factor in the repairs not being carried out at the time before it was opened.
Transport Minister Martin Cullen and his predecessor Seamus Brennan insist they only found out about the faults a year later.
Yet officials in two sections of the Department of Transport were informed about the track problems before the opening and sent out a team to investigate.
Luas supremo Frank Allen, the chief executive of the Railway Procurement Agency (RPA), bluntly said yesterday: "The buck stops here." Mr Allen said that while he felt under pressure to get Luas rolling there was no question of trading this off with safety of passengers when the faults were found in April 2004, three months before the Luas started.
He did not inform the then minister Seamus Brennan as there was no safety issue involved.
A decision was taken to go ahead with the opening and carry out the repairs afterwards. Michael Sheedy, the RPA director and Luas project manager, revealed that Department of Transport officials were made aware of the problem at the time. "They were informed of the situation. It could even have been by myself. They sent out independent consultants who oversaw the job," he said.
The Rail Safety Inspectorate, who were attached to the department, were also informed and signed off on its safety before the opening. Following a report Mr Allen said: "I would have been aware if there was political pressure to open. This was not a consideration. Ultimately the buck stops here." It was also learned Luas chiefs blocked plans by the contractors AMB Joint Ventures to rip up more than one-third of the line.

© Irish Independent 2006
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independe...issue_id=13515

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by Irish Times

Luas repair bill will be paid by contractor, says RPA

Repair work on Dublin's two Luas lines will begin in the next few months, with the State company responsible for the system insisting that the multimillion euro bill will have to be paid by the contractor who laid the tracks, writes Stephen Collins, Political Correspondent

The director of Luas at the Railway Procurement Agency (RPA), Michael Sheedy, acknowledged that the cost of repairing the system would run into millions of euro, but he denied the problems had arisen because of a design fault.

He said the problems with the Luas lines, revealed in yesterday's Irish Times, had arisen because something had gone wrong with the debonding material under the tracks and they still did not know why this had happened.

Mr Sheedy said the repair work would take place "probably without any noticeable disimprovement" in the system. He said the contractor, AMB Joint Venture, had accepted its responsibility in the matter.

However, one of the country's leading civil engineering experts, Prof Eugene O'Brien, professor of civil engineering at UCD, yesterday questioned the design and construction of the Luas lines, having read the full report by Austrian engineering experts in the possession of The Irish Times.

Prof O'Brien said a number of issues were raised in the report, the critical one being the problems identified at sharp bends in the lines.

He said the repair work to the straight sections of track should not cause serious disruption, but the problems identified with the bonding at the sharp bends could be a different matter.

The Labour Party's spokeswoman on transport, RóisÃ*n Shortall, said the serious flaws reported to have been found in sections of the lines were a matter of concern coming so soon after the construction of the system.

"Commuters will find it difficult to understand how such an expensive project could have encountered such problems, so soon, that the report warns if left untreated they could lead to doubts about the reliability and proper functioning of the system," she said.

The Green Party's transport spokesman, Eamon Ryan, said that coming on the same day that further flaws were identified with Dublin Port Tunnel, the problems with the Luas tracks were remarkable.

"It is increasingly clear that this Government simply does not know how to deliver large infrastructure projects on time, on budget and to the proper required standards," he said.

However, a spokesman for the Department of Transport accused the Opposition politicians of trying to "spook" the public into blaming the Government for the problems.

"There are three central issues here - cost, safety and disruption. The RPA has confirmed to the Minister and the department that there will be no cost to the taxpayer, no threat to safety and minimal disruption," he said.

"Political attempts to spook the public into thinking otherwise are regrettable. It is the responsibility of the contractor to put this right and that's what will be done."

© The Irish Times 2006
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/fro...32HM1LUAS.html

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by Irish Times

AMB 'obliged to remedy problem' on Luas lines

The following is the statement issued by the Railway Procurement Agency:

Concern has been expressed about the performance of sections of Luas track, in particular the use of a polymer material in certain sections of the track outside the city centre. Media reports have referred to a technical report prepared for AMB Joint Venture, which was the main contractor responsible for building the Luas infrastructure.

The polymer material referred to is a synthetic compound intended to provide a resilient support for the tram rails. The benefit of such a system is that it reduces the noise and vibration generated by trams.

In April 2004, prior to the start of the Luas passenger service, quality control procedures revealed that some of the bonding between the polymer material and the adjoining concrete was not performing to specification.

Detailed analysis of the problem by specialist engineers has demonstrated that there is no risk to safety or to the normal operation of the system for the foreseeable future.

This monitoring has continued on a regular basis since the start of passenger service and there has been no deterioration in the safety or operating performance of the system.

The main Luas contractor, AMB Joint Venture, was required to provide a system with a design life of 50 years, without exceptional maintenance.

RPA is of the view that the performance in the areas in question would not achieve this design life and AMB accepts this view.

AMB is contractually obliged to remedy the problem, to RPA's satisfaction, and at no cost to the taxpayer.

It is expected that rectification works will commence later this year and that the technical solution chosen will result in little or no interruption to passenger services.

© The Irish Times 2006
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ire...STATEMENT.html

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by Irish Independent

Luas talk can save lives
THE spectacle of 70 miserable Luas passengers trekking on foot along the Red Line in the rain yesterday, abruptly reduced to the status of pedestrians, summed up this whole dismal scandal.

Scandal is not too strong a word for a badly conceived and poorly executed project that has already cost the taxpayer €800m, with a €400m overrun.

And now it looks set to cost perhaps another €100m in running repairs. We are told that someone else will pay the total repair bill this time. Would anybody like to bet?

Worse still, it now appears that passengers' safety has been compromised from the very start.

It appears that officials of the Rail Procurement Agency knew, months before the Luas was launched, that there were detectable flaws in the rail support system.

The excuse that they chose not to reveal this to the then minister Seamus Brennan because it seemed somehow irrelevant is simply not acceptable.

It is outrageous that this major national project was allowed to go ahead in the full knowledge that there were problems. Weaselly protests that there was no immediate risk to the public are, again, completely unacceptable.

If some God-like figure in the RPA took it upon himself to decide there was no risk to passengers, then he has been proven wrong.

For it is now clear that if the investigation by the Institute for Railway Engineering at the University of Graz had not revealed the potential gravity of the fact that bits of rubberised track foundation were coming adrift, the situation would probably have gone unattended to. Soon it would have become a danger to life itself.

What can have been the motivation for such a cavalier dismissal of the flaws? Could it have anything to do with the fact that this project had already become a political football, as it has been ever since?

The then Minister, Seamus Brennan, inherited the Luas project from his predecessor, Mary O'Rourke, and was the man most likely to suffer political damage if there were further delays or more overspending.

Even back then, the minister appeared to adopt a curiously self-distancing attitude to the project.

A year before the Luas launch, Mr Brennan was publicly asserting that the original estimates for the project had been a "back of the envelope" job. It was unfair to complain to him, the minister, that costs had gone mad, because those original estimates had been plucked out of thin air in the first place.

At the same time, former Fine Gael Taoiseach and tormentor of Luas enthusiasts, Garret FitzGerald, was taking the sceptical line.

He pointed out that the traffic projections for the Luas plan were already sadly out of date, even when the project was approved. The Luas was designed to solve a problem for the early 1990s, not the 21st century, he argued.

In that climate of tension between political parties, and apparently within the main Government party itself, it is unlikely that a whistleblower would have been thanked for drawing attention to a mysterious substance called Corkelast.

Corkelast, as everyone now knows, is the liquid which is poured under the Luas rail where it sets like hard rubber. Oh how we, the public, the passengers, would have loved to hear a bit more about Corkelast and its drawbacks a couple of years ago when we took those first tentative trips on the sleek new trams.

The whistleblower finally turned up yesterday when Professor Eugene O'Brien, Professor of Civil Engineering at UCD, asserted in a quiet, authoritative and wholly unpartisan way, that the problem was serious and that the bends on the Luas lines were going to need a complete redesign.

"We're happy with the design," was the blunt response of the Luas project director.

It is much the same attitude that prompted someone to hold back information on another occasion. But this time we are in a position to ask why. And this time all the questions, whether cost or safety related, must be answered.

© Irish Independent 2006
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independe...issue_id=13515

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by Irish Examiner

Luas body says repairs pose no safety threat
By Caroline O'Doherty
EXPERTS have disagreed about the severity of flaws discovered in the Luas tram lines which will cost millions of euro to repair.

A leading independent engineer warned yesterday that the problems, if not resolved, could lead to a derailment, but the Railway Procurement Agency (RPA), the State body overseeing the Luas project, said there was no threat to safety.

A study commissioned by the main contractors involved in the building of Dublin's light rail system found a material laid over the concrete bed beneath the tracks to reduce noise and vibration was not sticking properly in places.

The study was carried out by the Institute of Railway Engineering at the University of Graz in Austria for AMB Joint Ventures, a private multi-national consortium which was preparing to hand over the Luas lines to State ownership.

The experts from Graz found problems along 8km of track on the outer reaches of the two Luas lines. They called the problem "debonding", which means the special polymer material was coming unstuck in places.

Debonding was most severe where the track bends, and it was noted that rain water was able to get in between the concrete and the polymer. The study concluded: "The development of bonding deficiencies gives rise to foresee a growing uncertainty towards the reliability and proper functioning of the system."

The existence of the report was only revealed publicly yesterday but RPA chiefs have been in discussion with AMB since late last year about ways of addressing the problems.

Repair works are scheduled to begin in April and Luas project manager at the RPA, Michael Sheedy, said it was hoped the works would be carried out at night to prevent disruption to the 70,000 passengers who use the Luas each day.

Mr Sheedy said the costs, estimated to run into millions, would all be borne by AMB as the consortium's contract specified that it could only complete the hand-over of the project to the State when it was finished to the standard that would withstand the need for major repairs or improvements for 50 years.

But while the RPA accepted the need for the repairs, it disputed suggestions that the flaws threatened passenger safety.

Eugene O'Brien, Professor of Civil Engineering at University College Dublin, said: "In the bends, it's quite serious because if the water gets in there as the train is going around the corner, it pushes and it squeezes the water out and this squeezing effect can destabilise the whole thing so that the rail would eventually become separated completely," he told RTÉ radio.

"If you ignored it indefinitely... eventually you would get a derailment."

RPA spokesman Ger Hannon said the agency did not accept Prof O'Brien's assessment and denied there was a design problem.

"There is no safety issue involved, there is no cost to the taxpayer and there is a fairly simple solution," Mr Hannon said.

He said the repairs would take a few months and would be subjected to fresh quality control checks before AMB was allowed hand the lines over to the State.

© Irish Examiner 2006
http://www.irishexaminer.com/pport/w...QQ5wn3uAIg.asp

[Thomas J Stamp]

I find the Irish Indo article published above upsetting. Why were there 70 people walking along the red line, was it because they were scared to take the tram, because thet's the impression I get from the atricle. It also gives me the impression that the luas will derail because of this. It's quite alarmist, isnt it?

In relation to the issue itself, is this polymer merely used for soundproofing and reducing the noise of the rail or is this actually the material which sticks the rail to the ground? I read the links to the pages for the people who make it but I'm still confused.

[Mark Gleeson]

Originally Posted by thomasjstamp

I find the Irish Indo article published above upsetting. Why were there 70 people walking along the red line

A tram broke down on the Red line yesterday morning around 11-11:30

The design as far as I can tell consists of a base then this polymer material and the sleeper block on top. The rail is fastened using standard clips its the sleeper that is attached to the concrete base with this polymer to dampen vibration and noise

It is very very easy to construct a scenario where the defects will lead to derailment, remember the track is continously welded and the sleepers job its to resist the forces in the rail caused by changes in temperature, if the blocks are loose the rail can expand/contract at will the rail then buckles within its 'safe' per stressed temperature range, resulting in a guage variation and derailment

[PaulM]

Originally Posted by thomasjstamp

I find the Irish Indo article published above upsetting. Why were there 70 people walking along the red line, was it because they were scared to take the tram, because thet's the impression I get from the atricle. It also gives me the impression that the luas will derail because of this. It's quite alarmist, isnt it?

I have found the Indo becoming more and more like a tabloid. It tends to go for scare tactics and worse case scenarios. I only pick it up if I'm in a cafe and need something to get me in a bad mood with the media.

I would take it's reporting on this issue with a grain of salt.

[Mark Gleeson]

The Indo editorial has hit just about every issue with the Luas it is a complete mess

On sleeper block front I finally nailed the photo we need, I've attached it here since the website of the company edilon seems to spend a lot of time offline

As the images clearly shows there is a layer between the sleeper and the concrete bed, that is where the Corkelast material is placed.

As you can see the sleeper block is unstrained apart from the Corkelast layer so if that fails the sleeper block has total freedom to move in line with my derailment scenario, this is a very very real and present safety risk just pray it does'nt get seriously cold or +25 degrees

How about some perspective here before the RPA witchhunt shall we.

1. The Indo Article above is mental. I pissed myself laughing reading it. They have always had it in for Luas, as the Abbey Street line construction made it hard for Sir Tony's driver to get the limo in and out. Even by their stardards this is pretty bonkers.
   
2. The contractor says they will pay for the repair. Great.
   
3. The work will be done at night (unlike CIE/IE) and will not affect services. Even better.
   
4. The Luas is hugely popular with the travelling public who actually use public transport rather than write hysterical articles about it in newspapers.
   
5. It has been a major success in terms of public transport and getting people who never used public transport before, out of their cars (especially on the Green Line) - 20 million passengers can't be wrong.
   
6. The CIE visionaries in their 1973 Dublin Rail Plan wanted to turn the Harcourt Street Line into a busway. The RPA were the ones who finally put tracks on that route.
   
7. Mini-CTC anybody? How many CIE people got the sack for that?

This is a classic "slow news day" story.

[Kevin K Kelehan]

The Railway Procurement Agency were incorporated to Procure a light railway; they procured chaos on Harcourt St and 30m trams which now at great expense are being legnthed it now appears that a sub-standard engineered light railway track infrastructure has been delivered. After mal-supervision and sub-standard rolling stock we now have substandard track.

As for the 20m passengers; they use Luas mainly because the alternative is buses on routes devoid/semi-devoid of QBCs if a broad gauge dart were available I'm sure most would select that.

Mark is right this report should be released into the public domain.

Kevin, the RPA are no more perfect than CIE. I cannot understand why the RPA will not put 40M trams on the Tallaght line any more than Irish Rail claim that railfreight is not workable in Ireland.


One man's bull****...

[sean]

I don't know why they didn't just use full concrete sleepers and ballast to start off with.

[philip]

Originally Posted by sean

I don't know why they didn't just use full concrete sleepers and ballast to start off with.

Somebody asked this on boards too. I answered that I thought ballasted track was more maintenance intensive as it would have to be weedsprayed from time to time and (maybe) retamped, though thinking about the lightweight nature of a tram, I doubt it. I assume ballasted track was used on the green line as it's (in theory) to be upgraded to metro and requires the track to take much heavier trains going forward.

Not be be rude about where anyone lives now (I live in an area just like much of D24!), but ballast = ammunition to fire at the trams. maybe that played a part in the decision making process-leave nothing not bolted down type of design!

Not be be rude about where anyone lives now (I live in an area just like much of D24!), but ballast = ammunition to fire at the trams. maybe that played a part in the decision making process-leave nothing not bolted down type of design

!

It was I am sure. If you look at the ballasted parts in West Dublin they tend to fenced off and hard to access.

One day in Cabra I watched a group of the local vermin throwing ballast at passing trains. One of the rocks came back off a carraige like a bullet back at them and landed in the canal with a mighty splash. Pity it didn't hit one of them in the head. I had no mobile at the time so I went to a pay phone on Carnlough Road to call the Garda, but the phone was vandalised by the same animals who were throwing ballast at the trains.

Great country eh?

[Mark Gleeson]

The entire Luas system was to be concrete slab style, the only section which isn't is from Beechwood to Sandyford to allow for a latter upgrade to metro and at the red cow depot mainly due to complex point work

If the slab track is installed correctly it has a significantly lower operating cost over its lifetime, it doesn't require tamping etc. Ballasted track on the other hand is cheaper and way quicker to install but requires more maintenance, its also easier for pointwork and also easier to alter later.

Its got zlich to do with the local trouble makers

Notice how the Luas story died off in the media as quickly as its began. Classic slow news day story coupled with the Indo's vendetta against Luas for making Sir Tony late for his lunch meeting at Fitzer or whatever put them in their Luas witchhunt mode.

I think the RPA handled the whole thing well. They came out and explained what happened, and what was being hyped-up by some people as if hundreds of passengers had been killed in a firey explosion caused by a drunken tram driver crashing his Luas into a truck filled with adorable puppies, was reduced to the technical glitch it simply was all along. We are only starting to build light rail in this country and like the motorway programme, there is going to be a learning curve.

[philip]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

Its got zlich to do with the local trouble makers

Well, if that is indeed the case then the designers fcuked up. You simply have to factor in the 'Dublin scumbag' element or you haven't done your job properly. I feel confident in saying that if the luas passed near my area (which isn't a warzone but has some undesirables) on ballasted track that it would have been targetted with that same ballast used as ammunition. As ThomasS has pointed out-it even happens in areas difficult to access along the heavy ral lines into the city.

[Donal Quinn]

I think I agree with ThomasS
compare this story to the cahir viaduct collapse

in this case a flaw has been discovered, the people responsible have to pay for the repair which will be timed to minimise passenger inconvenience, BEFORE an accident has happened and the public is kept informed (well sort of - but there hasn't been a full-scale cover up)

with cahir IE had independent experts screaming at them for ages and they just ignored this until the collapse occured

although this is embarrassing it's a much better way of doing things than we have seen before.... might even rub off on IE