Irish rail prices compared to Europe

James Shields · 13-01-2016, 11:27

http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-rail-...omment-4653819

Not sure the single route they picked is representative, but interesting anyway.

James

Dublin13 · 13-01-2016, 20:08

As my old lecturer used to say, they are lies, damned lies and statistic.

I tend not to take any notice of such surveys, because if you look hard enough for any country you can find a pair of stations that would back up your viewpoint either way.

James Howard · 14-01-2016, 08:06

As far as I know in Ireland, season tickets are directly proportional to distance and don't make the allowances to quality of service that are included in ticket office fares.

The real elephant in the room in Ireland is the massive implicit discount handed to top-rate tax payers which is very regressive. While I am personally a huge beneficiary of this it is fundamentally unfair that somebody on the top-rate tax pays less for their train pass that somebody on the minimum wage or even a student.

It would be far better for the government to just increase the subvention to support heavier monthly pass discounting and kill Taxsaver or else convert it into a Tax Credit.

Without tax-saver the discount for a monthly pass (over return tickets for each working day) on the Sligo line past Maynooth is only around 25% which is very low. I got a 60% discount in Germany for a weekly ticket between two cities about 40km apart and the weekly also included all local public transport in both cities. No faffing about with point-to-point, bus, bus+rail, bus+rail+Luas, etc - it included everything.

vegas82 · 14-01-2016, 10:02

I agree...pricing structures need to be fairer to all...and I hadnt even considered that as a higher rate tax payer i'm getting a cheaper train ticket.

It also BAFFLES me that the annual tax saver dart ticket is cheaper than a leap card for my journey. I travel from Clontarf Road to Lansdowne and return every day which is a short journey yet the annual unlimited travel train ticket is cheaper...ridiculous...

berneyarms · 14-01-2016, 11:12

To be fair the people paying the higher rate of tax are more likely to be driving in the first place rather than taking public transport than those on the lower rate.

You need to provide a decent carrot to make them switch - that's what the taxsaver scheme does through the reduction in gross pay.

James Howard · 14-01-2016, 11:25

Correspondingly though, the high cost of a travel pass for the lower-paid is a significant barrier to them taking up employment. At the very most, the standard rate (or lower) tax-payer should be paying the same for their transport as somebody making 100 grand a year.

Changing the system over to a tax-credit would allow all workers to access public transport at the same cost. The present system is a strongly regressive tax measure.

In the overall scheme of things, it probably wouldn't cost very much as it would allow people from areas with poor employment prospects take up employment in areas where there is a shortage of workers.

13-01-2016, 11:27	#1
James Shields Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Drogheda, Ireland Posts: 1,275	Irish rail prices compared to Europe http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-rail-...omment-4653819 Not sure the single route they picked is representative, but interesting anyway. James

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13-01-2016, 20:08	#2
Dublin13 Regular Poster Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 130	As my old lecturer used to say, they are lies, damned lies and statistic. I tend not to take any notice of such surveys, because if you look hard enough for any country you can find a pair of stations that would back up your viewpoint either way.

14-01-2016, 08:06	#3
James Howard Really Really Regluar Poster Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sligo Line Posts: 1,115	As far as I know in Ireland, season tickets are directly proportional to distance and don't make the allowances to quality of service that are included in ticket office fares. The real elephant in the room in Ireland is the massive implicit discount handed to top-rate tax payers which is very regressive. While I am personally a huge beneficiary of this it is fundamentally unfair that somebody on the top-rate tax pays less for their train pass that somebody on the minimum wage or even a student. It would be far better for the government to just increase the subvention to support heavier monthly pass discounting and kill Taxsaver or else convert it into a Tax Credit. Without tax-saver the discount for a monthly pass (over return tickets for each working day) on the Sligo line past Maynooth is only around 25% which is very low. I got a 60% discount in Germany for a weekly ticket between two cities about 40km apart and the weekly also included all local public transport in both cities. No faffing about with point-to-point, bus, bus+rail, bus+rail+Luas, etc - it included everything.

14-01-2016, 10:02	#4
vegas82 New to the board Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 20	I agree...pricing structures need to be fairer to all...and I hadnt even considered that as a higher rate tax payer i'm getting a cheaper train ticket. It also BAFFLES me that the annual tax saver dart ticket is cheaper than a leap card for my journey. I travel from Clontarf Road to Lansdowne and return every day which is a short journey yet the annual unlimited travel train ticket is cheaper...ridiculous...

14-01-2016, 11:12	#5
berneyarms Really Regular Poster Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 602	To be fair the people paying the higher rate of tax are more likely to be driving in the first place rather than taking public transport than those on the lower rate. You need to provide a decent carrot to make them switch - that's what the taxsaver scheme does through the reduction in gross pay.

14-01-2016, 11:25	#6
James Howard Really Really Regluar Poster Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Sligo Line Posts: 1,115	Correspondingly though, the high cost of a travel pass for the lower-paid is a significant barrier to them taking up employment. At the very most, the standard rate (or lower) tax-payer should be paying the same for their transport as somebody making 100 grand a year. Changing the system over to a tax-credit would allow all workers to access public transport at the same cost. The present system is a strongly regressive tax measure. In the overall scheme of things, it probably wouldn't cost very much as it would allow people from areas with poor employment prospects take up employment in areas where there is a shortage of workers.