View Full Version : Busking on the dart
I was on a peak hour dart north bound and there was a guy busking on the train. He seems to be doing it quite often. What is irish rails position on busking. Is it within their rule book?
Mark Gleeson
05-03-2007, 18:22
Its against the rules
Section 23 SI 109 1984
23. (1) No person while upon the railway or in any vehicle shall to the annoyance of any other person or if requested not to do so by an authorised person, sing, perform on any musical or other instrument or use any gramophone, record player, tape recorder or portable wireless or television apparatus.
(2) No person while upon the railway or in any vehicle shall, except by permission of an authorised person display or exhibit any printed, written or pictorial matter or any article for the purpose of advertising or publicity, or distribute any book, leaflet or other printed matter or any sample or other article;
(3) No person shall—
( a ) sell or expose or offer for sale or cause or permit to be sold or exposed or offered for sale any article or goods whatsoever; or
( b ) tout, ply for, or solicit or cause or permit touting or plying for or soliciting alms, reward or custom or employment of any description.
I like the clause in 23 (1) above where it says "to the annoyance of"
I was on the DART last week and a few kids had some sort of death metal or something playing. I was thinking to myself that if it was boyzone or shelflife I would tell them to turn it off, but I was quite enjoying the metal.
dowlingm
05-03-2007, 19:34
In Toronto buskers on 25 of the TTC subway/bus station platforms audition for their spots - the spots cost $150 (100 Euro) to the successful recipients. The auditions are open to the public and have run for about 25 years.
http://www.theex.com/whatson.php?menu=01:12
In Toronto buskers on 25 of the TTC subway/bus station platforms audition for their spots - the spots cost $150 (100 Euro) to the successful recipients. The auditions are open to the public and have run for about 25 years.
http://www.theex.com/whatson.php?menu=01:12
That would be brilliant. I think in this country we seem to forbid everything e.g. no football on the streets, no drinking on the boardwalk, no music on the DART, instead of dealing with things in a more rational manner.
Derek Wheeler
05-03-2007, 23:15
In Toronto buskers on 25 of the TTC subway/bus station platforms audition for their spots - the spots cost $150 (100 Euro) to the successful recipients. The auditions are open to the public and have run for about 25 years.
http://www.theex.com/whatson.php?menu=01:12
I have to say that is the way to do it. But Celtic Tiger Ireland likes to forget its human side.
2Funki4Wheelz
06-03-2007, 09:57
I have to say that is the way to do it. But Celtic Tiger Ireland likes to forget its human side.
The
"I can't give change to a busker, I need it for my double moccachino expresso skinny latte overpriced coffee when I get off...and anyway the racket they're making is interfering with my video iPod"
Mark Gleeson
06-03-2007, 10:03
To be honest I'd rather they get lost and leave us to doze.
If I had a euro for every time I've come across someone busking or trying to sell me something I'd have enough for a night out. Its a big problem its annoying
To be honest I'd rather they get lost and leave us to doze.
If I had a euro for every time I've come across someone busking or trying to sell me something I'd have enough for a night out. Its a big problem its annoying
You don't have to give them anything.
I've encountered the same busker guy. He always seems to get on at Killester and gets off at Raheny or Kilbarrack, he does it during the afternoon usually.
I gave him loose change the first time but now him and his music piss me off!
Derek Wheeler
06-03-2007, 23:25
The
"I can't give change to a busker, I need it for my double moccachino expresso skinny latte overpriced coffee when I get off...and anyway the racket they're making is interfering with my video iPod"
Eh...yep.
Derek Wheeler
06-03-2007, 23:26
To be honest I'd rather they get lost and leave us to doze.
If I had a euro for every time I've come across someone busking or trying to sell me something I'd have enough for a night out. Its a big problem its annoying
Eh...nope.
Derek Wheeler
06-03-2007, 23:26
I've encountered the same busker guy. He always seems to get on at Killester and gets off at Raheny or Kilbarrack, he does it during the afternoon usually.
I gave him loose change the first time but now him and his music piss me off!
Eh....ask for a request?
I wouldn't have a problem with licensed buskers in the stations, but I think they should be kept out of the carriages. Not everyone wants to hear them and while you can walk past someone in a single spot, getting trapped in a carriage with it could become frustrating. Also, when they come looking for money, it can be intimidating for someone who doesn't speak much of the local language.
I've encountered this in France, the UK and the Netherlands. It's disheartening to learn that it's spreading to Dublin.
dowlingm
07-03-2007, 20:29
what I hate are people who hand out leaflets on the sly - and one Sunday a guy was leaving religious newspapers on empty seats/window ledges of the subway car. If you are paying a fee to TTC to spread your crap on advertising boards or the platform TV - fine. I don't like it, but that keeps my Metropass cost down a bit. But if you want to spread your crap for free then fewk off I say.
Mark Gleeson
07-03-2007, 21:56
The current trend is to go around leaving small trinkets on the seats of a coach then coming back and trying to sell them
The total lack of a security presence doesn't help
The current trend is to go around leaving small trinkets on the seats of a coach then coming back and trying to sell them
The total lack of a security presence doesn't help
Excellent. I've seen this in various other countries. not sure it will work on the irish. you give us free stuff and we keep it!
Colm Donoghue
12-03-2007, 11:27
23. (1) No person while upon the railway or in any vehicle shall to the annoyance of any other person or if requested not to do so by an authorised person, sing, perform on any musical or other instrument or use any gramophone, record player, tape recorder or portable wireless or television apparatus.
Does this mean if someone's on their phone, and it causes me "annoyance" then the other person is breaking the law? it's wireless and it's portable.
I'd wonder how this would stack up against article 41.6.1 of bunreacht na hEireann, if it's matter of public order or if it's immoral.
What used to bug me was the interference phones made to my walkman before a call came in.
Thomas J Stamp
12-03-2007, 17:30
I'd wonder how this would stack up against article 41.6.1 of bunreacht na hEireann, if it's matter of public order or if it's immoral.
One of my lecturers once told me that you only mention the constitution when you havent got a real case. He was right, as it happens.
Damn! You mean I can't bring my gramophone on the Enterprise or CDE/MK4.. I'd love to see how the needle would hold up :)
The free trinkets reminds me of a book club, we had some random company send books to our house and then try to bill us for them (no one had signed anything).
After a few threatening letters, I wrote to them suggesting that they pay the €800 storage fee that I was now charging for the safe keeping of their books.
Never heard from them again.
Colm Donoghue
12-03-2007, 18:04
touche TJS.
To be fair I couldn't see a prosecution against someone for using their mobile phone on a train holding up. or for using a walkman.
There has been an increase in busking on the darts no matter what time of the day you are on it. Last week i was going into town from Dun Laoghaire at lunch time and there was two non irish busking. I actually felt very intimated by them, as they were very pushy looking for money and with no security around, i got very frightened and got off at the next stop and waited for the next dart into town.
Can IE not do something about them.
Mark Gleeson
16-11-2007, 19:39
Tell the driver, he or she will either stop and wait for the Gardai or arrange to have them meet the train at the next main station. Its easy blame Irish Rail but if you don't report it on the spot there is nothing that can be done
It is an offense to beg, busk etc anywhere on the railway
Hi Mark. There is no IE officals on the train to report it and how can you report it to the driver when you don't see him and to be honest after along day work and commute the last thing you want to be doing us waiting around for the gardai to come and deal with them.
Mark Gleeson
16-11-2007, 20:17
The train has a driver and in my experience if you report something they will take very quick action. Simply march up to the front of the train and you will find the driver
Sadly in some cases this will result in a delay to the train, but that sends a message that anti-social and other illegal activaties will not be tolerated which creates an image of a safe public transport system
Bang on Mark. No-one should be frightened on any public service as this will not be tolerated. The train driver will be very quick in reacting to this matter.
23. (1) No person while upon the railway or in any vehicle shall to the annoyance of any other person or if requested not to do so by an authorised person, sing, perform on any musical or other instrument or use any gramophone, record player, tape recorder or portable wireless or television apparatus.
Just got a glimpse on the statute book and some of the guidelines it doesn't really concern present times does it? do you know of someone who owns a gramophone or carrys around a record player, tape recorder?
Colm Moore
27-08-2008, 16:59
I own two tape players, but no, I don't carry them around. :)
The objective was to prevent rules lawyering.
Thomas J Stamp
31-08-2008, 22:10
Thanks to bloody IE I cant play my Cole Porter 33's anymore as the needle keeps skipping due to the fecking bumpy track :mad:
after all that time i spent in that swiss deportment school with those nubile teenage girls learning how to balance the record player on my lap and all.
i shall be sending them my invoice
weehamster
31-08-2008, 22:41
http://www.smileys-gratos.com/Smile/Hip-hop/36_10_4.gif
Yo Yo Yo! Dis goes out to all my Brothers & Sisters on d DART crew. Respect to d R.U.I. posse - WORD
http://myspace-190.vo.llnwd.net/01460/09/17/1460137190_l.jpg
:D
Alan French
02-01-2009, 20:57
Busking is another of those issues where total bans can be over the top, and total permission can be disastrous too. I remember someone trying to argue that it was an issue of freedom of speech, and I thought: he's not helping his cause. Busking has legitimacy only insofar as it adds atmosphere to a place; it cannot be a right. Which points back to a licensing system, as some countries have.
I think some buskers I have seen on the DART are Hungarian gipsies. In Hungary there is more of a tradition of gipsy musicians playing in all sorts of places (e.g. restuarants), and expected to be paid by the listeners, unlike here where they would be paid by the owner of the place.
Colm Moore
16-11-2009, 05:42
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/letters/2009/1116/1224258921057.html Busking on the Dart
Madam, – The Dart boasts it has installed closed circuit TV for the protection and safety of its passengers. Yet, this does not appear to function, as begging on the Dart goes on every day with impunity.
This begging is accomplished by two individuals at a time, one plays “music” on an accordion, the other tries to collect from each passenger who is forced to listen to this “music”, which few wish to hear.
This begging and busking on the Dart should be nipped in the bud. I use the Dart daily and have seldom seen an inspector. The Dart can well afford to recruit a security team to police it from unauthorised begging and busking and any other undesirable traits. The passengers are entitled to no less. – Yours, etc,
MICHEÁL Ó NUALLÁIN,
Monkstown,
Co Dublin.
drumcondra commuter
16-11-2009, 11:48
Oh please. It's called public transport for a reason you know.
Thomas Ralph
16-11-2009, 12:49
Anyone who has a problem with people playing music or asking for money on trains or at stations should report it to the driver or to the booking clerk at any station. Both are against the CIÉ bylaws. I've done so on several occasions and the offenders were removed from CIÉ property fairly sharpish.
I was on a dart recently with the above going on.
Security came up from carriage behind but by the time security entered the carriage the 2 people sat down and security just walked by them and stopped.
The people playing the music got off at the next stop
Nothing was said to them.
I was on a dart recently with the above going on.
Security came up from carriage behind but by the time security entered the carriage the 2 people sat down and security just walked by them and stopped.
The people playing the music got off at the next stop
Nothing was said to them.
i used to See that quiet alot when i used to get the dart in the morning. Same carry on.
Funny enough there is another older thread http://www.railusers.ie/forum/showthread.php?t=2102 goes by the exact same name. With an interesting question raised as to if should be allowed compared to other countries
Thomas Ralph
16-11-2009, 16:19
23. (1) No person while upon the railway or in any vehicle shall to the annoyance of any other person or if requested not to do so by an authorised person, sing, perform on any musical or other instrument or use any gramophone, record player, tape recorder or portable wireless or television apparatus.
Does this mean if someone's on their phone, and it causes me "annoyance" then the other person is breaking the law? it's wireless and it's portable.
No, a mobile phone isn't on that list of things that they're not allowed to use. A "portable wireless" is a radio.
No, a mobile phone isn't on that list of things that they're not allowed to use. A "portable wireless" is a radio.
i would have thought that too myself with regards to the radio. I do remember an irish rail ad at stations a while back [might still be there ] asking people to respect other passengers by keeping the volume down. Had an annoying experience of dance music on full volume on speakers a couple of weeks ago on a train. Gave me a headache !
I know its not directly not related to the thread but seen as though its one of the rules mentioned above.
I noticed that there is an increasingly number of beggars in the main station in connolly.
Its starting to get annoying as they are coming up to you every day. I have had the same guy come up to me every day. I have given him four or five euro but he kept on saying to me can you go to the atm and take out more when i told him i had no other change.
When i said no yesterday he gave me a bit of grief but went away. I have seen him every day for the last week , at different times uses
the same excuse that he has just got off the boat and offer change for petrol for the car or the bus fare .
Thomas J Stamp
07-01-2010, 16:48
Its starting to get annoying as they are seen in here nearly every day!
that's a terrible way to describe the denizens of the members section.
there are of course "quiet zones" on intercity trains, which of course is either a wonderful invention or an admission that the existing bye-laws are not going to be enforced on the rest of the train, depending on how cynical one is.
anyway, bonus points to the man who wrote that letter about the accordion playing by our friends from the east. it is well known that as well as water boarding the CIA would sometimes go to such extreme measures as bringing in such people into the interrogation rooms for the extraction of information from hardened terrorists. If that failed they would then resort to Country and Irish :eek:
that's a terrible way to describe the denizens of the members section.
there are of course "quiet zones" on intercity trains, which of course is either a wonderful invention or an admission that the existing bye-laws are not going to be enforced on the rest of the train, depending on how cynical one is.
anyway, bonus points to the man who wrote that letter about the accordion playing by our friends from the east. it is well known that as well as water boarding the CIA would sometimes go to such extreme measures as bringing in such people into the interrogation rooms for the extraction of information from hardened terrorists. If that failed they would then resort to Country and Irish :eek:
apologies i have just seen that last paragraph i wrote embarrassing to say the least. I meant to say its annoying that the same people come up to you every day dont remember you giving them a couple of euro earlier and then abuse you when you say you already did.
I have edited my earlier post !
Thomas J Stamp
07-01-2010, 17:16
apologies i have just seen that last paragraph i wrote embarrassing to say the least. I meant to say its annoying that the same people come up to you every day dont remember you giving them a couple of euro earlier and then abuse you when you say you already did.
I have edited my earlier post !
don't be embarrassed by it, tis grand. its when they refuse to give you the magazine after you've given them the money that it gets funny, and some little minder bloke with a stavros tache comes out of nowhere giving out to you to make it really comic
Colm Moore
07-01-2010, 17:28
there are of course "quiet zones" on intercity trains, which of course is either a wonderful invention or an admission that the existing bye-laws are not going to be enforced on the rest of the train, depending on how cynical one is.I've never actually noticed a quiet carriage before in its official status, but coming down over Christmas, the train host was quite direct when someone onkly turned his headphones down from "unbelievably loud" to "inappropriately loud"
Thomas J Stamp
07-01-2010, 17:32
I've never actually noticed a quiet carriage before in its official status, but coming down over Christmas, the train host was quite direct when someone onkly turned his headphones down from "unbelievably loud" to "inappropriately loud"
they have little stickers up above the windows to tell you its a quiet zone.
don't be embarrassed by it, tis grand. its when they refuse to give you the magazine after you've given them the money that it gets funny, and some little minder bloke with a stavros tache comes out of nowhere giving out to you to make it really comic
ROFL!
I have never noticed that i have given the money but never taken the magazine but i have to check that out !
My friend has had some horrible experiences of that magazine at an ATM a while back!
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