New Irish Rail Logo?

[essoII]

Just after logging on to irishrail.ie and there seems to be a new logo for irishrail? I don't see the basis for justifying a rebrand. Can anyone shed any insight in to this?


*Edit: comparisons of previous logos and new one:

http://i.imgur.com/ys4Mxu2.jpg

[Destructix]

I preferred the 1994/5 logo (logo 1). Waste of money but there are other projects within IÉ at the moment which are costing us taxpayers/customers a lot more in fares and subsidies for services which carry less than 8 passengers daily. WRC and the Nenagh lines.

[Mark Gleeson]

This looks more like an afternoon with clip art and paint

[Thomas Ralph]

I don't think logo 1 was 94/95; that one had a lowercase I and E.

[Thomas J Stamp]

new logo reminds me of an old NI utility one, and the old crown paints thing.

rubbish.

when the ship is sinking, paint it.

[James Howard]

The deployment of this logo is just galling when we are putting up significant service reductions. It is going to be especially annoying if they start changing livery on trains to suit this as this is when it really starts costing money.

The aesthetic considerations are secondary but I cannot see how anybody can think that it is an improvement over the existing logo which while a bit boring is at least modern and integrates with the rest of their branding in that it uses the corporate font.

Meanwhile they can't even get themselves organised to get timetables distributed for display in my station. They have handouts but the last time I looked (Wednesday morning), they still had last-year's timetable posted on the platform. This is normal - it can take three or four weeks to get the new poster timetable out.

[essoII]

The deployment of this logo is just galling when we are putting up significant service reductions.
The aesthetic considerations are secondary but I cannot see how anybody can think that it is an improvement over the existing logo which while a bit boring is at least modern and integrates with the rest of their branding in that it uses the corporate font.



I think the previous logo was the first time they managed to almost achieve an across the board corporate identity (handouts, train service liveries, staff uniforms etc..) The new logo serves no logical function, is totally unjustified and will need a large financial investment (regardless of what they say) to achieve a swift total rebrand of all company services and paraphernalia.

[Mark Gleeson]

There is no budget for a rebranding exercise

Logo will be used on all new print and new signage as of Jan 2013

Since no EU tender appears to have been issued the cost of the logo was less than 10,000 euro it would appear

[James Howard]

I would love to know where these people studied marketing. As essoII said, this the first time in years that Irish Rail finally managed to get consistent branding on stations, signage, uniforms and the trains. Added to that, they seem to actually managed to get most of the staff to wear the uniform which is a first.

Then some genius buys a new logo out of petty cash and it is back to the the old way of bits and pieces. That is a bigger issue than the cost of the logo.

The indo has an brief note on this which once again mentions the non-existent 36 million which is now 30 million (or was this Irish Rail's portion of the non-existent dig-out).

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/irish-rail-silent-on-logo-cost-3368161.html

[Inniskeen]

There is no budget for a rebranding exercise

Logo will be used on all new print and new signage as of Jan 2013

Since no EU tender appears to have been issued the cost of the logo was less than 10,000 euro it would appear

State companies can spend a lot more than €10,000 without going near the EU journal.

[Thomas J Stamp]

i would imagine that as things perish and are replaced they will all have the new logo which will just be another design feature of the item being replaced and as such incoporated within that items cost.

[karlr42]

Noticed they've changed the Twitter username from Irish Rail to Iarnrod Eireann(handle is still @IrishRail). They really need to just pick a language and stick with it consistently.

[padair]

Sir,

In relation to the Official Languages Act, public bodies are permitted to design and use any logo in any area, and an exemption has been granted in relation to the use of Irish and English in such logos in the regulations under sub-section 9(1) of the OLA.

However, the logo is exempt from the regulations only where it does not contain the name of the public body.

As the previous "irishrail.ie" logo contained the name of the public body and was in English only, it was in breach of these regulations.

Regards,
Padder

[Mark Gleeson]

The change in logo has nothing to do with the Irish language issue. It was done for purely marketing reasons

The official letterhead was always the 2005 Iarnrod Eireann logo with the company information in both Irish and English

[Destructix]

IRISH Rail's cross-border staff are concerned that a new corporate logo, which features stylised triangles in the green, white and orange of the national flag, could leave them vulnerable because of tensions in the North.

Siptu has written to the company to outline the fears of workers.

However, Irish Rail has said trains will only be repainted with the new logo as part of the maintenance cycle.

It stressed that the Enterprise train service is a joint operation between North and South and that there were no plans to use the new logo on that service.


http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-rail-dismisses-staffs-flag-fears-29210977.html

Meanwhile 37 year old locomotives are again undergoing a costly respray to the new livery and branding.

[Jamie2k9]

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-rail-dismisses-staffs-flag-fears-29210977.html

Meanwhile 37 year old locomotives are again undergoing a costly respray to the new livery and branding.

The 071's are due an overhaul anyway.

[Mark Gleeson]

Only 1 locomotive and 1 coach currently carry the logo, only ones painted this year

About 650 vehicles in the fleet, need painting approx every 10 years, 60+ a year need a paint so. Logo is a transfer applied after painting or to replace worn

SIPTU really have become a joke in raising an issue about this, its petty and really shows SIPTU hasn't a clue about the major issues within Irish Rail

So for example Aer Lingus operate out of Belfast have never had a problem with a big green plane with a Shamrock and tricolour on the registration.

[Jamie2k9]

Only 1 locomotive and 1 coach currently carry the logo, only ones painted this year

About 650 vehicles in the fleet, need painting approx every 10 years, 60+ a year need a paint so. Logo is a transfer applied after painting or to replace worn

SIPTU really have become a joke in raising an issue about this, its petty and really shows SIPTU hasn't a clue about the major issues within Irish Rail

So for example Aer Lingus operate out of Belfast have never had a problem with a big green plane with a Shamrock and tricolour on the registration.

Wouldn't even count the 071 as having the logo seen as its while and not coloured like the Mark IV DVT. The 6 loco or less for Belfast services won't be painted with it and when the EGV's are sorted out there should be few failues once the 201's get some TLC every so often and they don't wait for a failure.

Your right about SIPTU but the crew for Aer Lingus in Belfast are not allowed operate in the Republic....says it all about the union.

[Colm Moore]

So for example Aer Lingus operate out of Belfast have never had a problem with a big green plane with a Shamrock and tricolour on the registration.The flip side is that Aer Lingus don't have to operate under bridges that people can throw things from.

[Inniskeen]

The flip side is that Aer Lingus don't have to operate under bridges that people can throw things from.

Until comparatively recent times the IR livery was some variant of Black and Tan.

[Thomas J Stamp]

im more worried that the logo looks like something from 1973. reminds me of the old crown paints one.

[Eddie]

I'm going to stick my neck out and say that I quite like the new logo. I like the symbol, the colours are fresh, and the dual language feels all-inclusive.

[James Howard]

I think that you would find that a significant proportion of our brethren up north would find the whole logo (both icon and text) not quite so inclusive as you do.

Irish Rail have never really had decent branding - the latest iteration is really no better or worse than the last so isn't really worth changing. They should either change nothing or spend decent money and get a proper logo that will last for 30 or 40 years. It would probably make more sense for Irish Rail to do a name change to an Irish name as the current dual-naming system dilutes their brand. The only problem is that Iarnrod Eireann is a bit difficult for non-irish speakers to spell for the internet, but they could have used something like rail.ie (like bahn.de) if they hadn't been so dumb as to let that domain be taken up by a squatter.

By contrast, Bus Éireann have, in my opinion, always had excellent branding and they have consistently used a similar logo since the CIE group was split. It is easy to understand as everyone knows about Greyhound and is well localised using a national symbol that doesn't offend anybody. It also reproduces well in reduced colour printing. The same could be said for the old CIE broken wheel logo.

[Thomas J Stamp]

and the dublin bus db logo

[James Howard]

I had forgotten about the DB logo. That is an excellent bit of design in that it manages to embed the company name into the city symbol.

[Jamie2k9]

IE are keeping the British up North sweet by dropping the flag from the logo on 22k sets 1 to 6 with TWPS.

It's ridiculous at this stage.

[dowlingm]

Don't know why they would bother painting 22001-6 differently. It's not like they send them North anyway... unless Mr Franks is bringing some new ideas to the Northern Line?

[Jamie2k9]

Don't know why they would bother painting 22001-6 differently. It's not like they send them North anyway... unless Mr Franks is bringing some new ideas to the Northern Line?

Could have something his hopes to have more trains to Belfast in future.

[dowlingm]

To be honest I think the best course for Dublin Belfast (assuming withdrawing the service entirely is off the table) would be for the service to be handed over to a third party train operating company. Nobody cares what colour the Aircoach is.

[Inniskeen]

Maybe they could go back to the old black and tan livery !

Best thing for the Belfast service (whoever runs it) is increased frequency, improved reliability and reduced journey time. Like the Cork line, trains were faster 20 to 30 years ago. Prior to the line being upgraded the fastest services took an hour and fifty one minutes.

The Dublin/Belfast service is hopelessly under-resourced with the entire service run by three sets which accumulate an average daily mileage well in excess of 600 miles each.

The Belfast line is handicapped by a difficult operating environment with hopelessly inadequate infrastructure, particularly between Malahide and Connolly. Scheduling anomalies and non-sensical operating practices complete the picture.

In the week ending yesterday of the the 106 services 50 were early or less than one minute late with a further 38 less than five minutes late. The remaining 18 services were either more than 5 minutes late (4 in excess of 30 minutes late), partially cancelled (2) or substituted by sub standard rolling stock including two operated by 2900 railcars. A further two services were substituted by C3K railcars.

Overcrowding remains a feature of many services although only one relief train operated.

Most of the weeks disruption was caused by OHLE problems at Howth Junction on Thursday, the incident involving the 1455 ex Bray on Friday and the knock-on effects of the OHLE problems near Dalkey on Tuesday.

Long standing speed restrictions at Malahide and Clongriffin remain a significant impediment to on time arrival at the Dublin end.

[Jamie2k9]

To be fair its up North where speed is a problem. I am not even sure if trains hit 80mph once they cross. The few times I use the route it seems to be a lot of 60 or 70. Once the Dart area near Dublin is cleared its largely 80mph without restriction.

I'm sure parts of the route in Co. Louth could be cleared for 90 or 100mph to improve times.

[dowlingm]

If the Enterprise was running with 22000s then presumably the distributed traction would allow the train to regain line speed more quickly out of the speed restrictions. I wonder if Adelaide Depot is as able (in terms of lifting jacks etc) to accommodate routine servicing of 22000s as it is C3Ks and C4Ks?

[Kilocharlie]

If the Enterprise was running with 22000s then presumably the distributed traction would allow the train to regain line speed more quickly out of the speed restrictions. I wonder if Adelaide Depot is as able (in terms of lifting jacks etc) to accommodate routine servicing of 22000s as it is C3Ks and C4Ks?

20000s can be maintained in Drogheda; in fact most of the Sligo/Rosslare/Dundalk 22000s are maintained there. No need for Adelaide to be involved.

[Inniskeen]

To be fair its up North where speed is a problem. I am not even sure if trains hit 80mph once they cross. The few times I use the route it seems to be a lot of 60 or 70. Once the Dart area near Dublin is cleared its largely 80mph without restriction.

I'm sure parts of the route in Co. Louth could be cleared for 90 or 100mph to improve times.

Yes Jamie, there are speed limits on NIR also although, as on Irish Rail, the general speed limit is 90 mph and is routinely achieved both by the Enterprise and local services to/from Portadown and Newry.

The main issues on NIR are scheduling, particularly in the Belfast direction (loads of padding), a 60 mph speed restriction in both directions for about seven miles (Lisburn to Moira) and the tortuous routing to Belfast Central (from Central Junction). There are also speed limits at Portadown (40), Scarva (70), Poyntzpass (45), Mullaghglass (60) and the top of the Wellington Bank (60).

Much of the route, currently cleared for 90 mph could sustain 100 mph. Future track renewals on NIR, starting with Lisburn/Lurgan are planned to be suitable for 125 mph running.

Yes C3Ks/C4Ks or ICRs would produce substantially better timings than locomotive hauled stock as is the case on the Cork line.